Functional Testing – How to Use a Stool Test for Better Client Outcomes

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Christine:         Hi everyone and welcome to this wonderful episode of the 360 Health Biz podcast with Kendra Perry, my wonderful partner and myself, Christine Hansen. 

Kendra:            Hello.

Christine:         And today we are super excited because we have a lot, lot to talk about, which is superinteresting for practitioners as well as if you are somewhat trying to improve your health. So first of though before we going into how should I say, introduced this steamy topic, we're going to have a quick round of shoutouts and we had two amazing people who left reviews for us on iTunes. So Kendra, maybe you want to introduce that because it was absolutely amazing and also to say hi to everyone.

Kendra:            Yeah, well, Hi Christine. I'm really excited for today's steamy topic because we're talking about poop, which is honestly my favorite topic ever, but I do want to give these shout outs so we got to five star reviews on iTunes. One from Justine. She says, ‘I've been wanting to listen to your podcasts since you launched. I finally got a chance to listen to episode one and I was blown away. The whole episode was gold. Thanks for doing this.’Thank you, Justine. I know who you are, Justine, and I'm so happy to hear from you and we so appreciate your awesome review, and then we have one more from Heather, and she says, 'Thank you Kendra and Christine, you have already made my life as a healthpreneur so much easier. I've learned so many actual tips and tricks that I feel confident with my business to grow to the next level. Your guests are top notch and exactly what I need to up level my confidence and take action. Already a huge supporter and fan. Keep up the great work. Thank you for sharing so freely.'Ooph.

Christine:         Woohoo, I absolutely love it.

Kendra:            That one feels good. I just feel all like warm and fuzzy. 

Christine:         Oh tearing up. No, it's amazing. Thank you so, so much. And all of you guys out there, please, please, please, we read these, you know, we have a happy dance each time we see those. So absolutely would appreciate it if you head over to iTunes and just leave that little five-star review and then just know that there's two people doing a happy dance just for you, so. 

Kendra:            Every time.

Christine:         All right, before we're going to geek out, we are mixing Biz and business education. So today we're going to have a tool of the day and we're going to talk about RocketLinks so you can find them at and if you go to our website, the, and you download our free tool guide, then you will find a link in there as well. And here is why RocketLink is absolutely fantastic. So as you hopefully know that is that Facebook is, for example, great to target people and to show them ads of what you do. Now the easiest thing to do is if you target people who are actually interested in you, so the more interested they are, the more engaged they are, the lower you pay as in price because Facebook says, Ooh, this person actually talks to people who like it, we get more engagement, people love Facebook again, so we're going to drop the price for the advertiser. Now the easiest way is when people have been what we call pixels by Facebook, which means that they have engaged with you, they've been tagged, so that when you tell Facebook who you want to talk to, when you do your ad, Facebook already knows, okay, all of these people, so engagement is better and cost is lower. Now the problem with that though, not necessarily problem, but you are limited because either these people have interests, interacted with you via Facebook on the platform, so that could happen via video, via post, a comment, checking out page and liking it, or you have installed the pixel on your website. So if someone goes to your website, the pixel tags them if they have a Facebook account and that way you can target them when you run your ads. But for everything else your pixel is pretty much useless. So let's say someone finds you on Pinterest, they will not be tagged because that's not how, Facebook doesn't have a place there to put a pixel on, which is basically this little sticker, you can imagine it like a sticker that's going to be put on you. So what RocketLink does is, that everyone who clicks on a link that is via RocketLink is going to be tagged via your Facebook pixel. So let's say you write a blog post, you have the URL for me, it might be and I will go to RocketLink, I will give them the link and they will transform it into a shorter link or one you can actually have your branding, so you have your particular RocketLink link that leads to your blog post and then I might go to LinkedIn and I share that link there and when people click on it, even though they are not on my website at that point, they will get pixeled or if you have it on Instagram or if you have it on Google+ or on Twitter, then people might even go and be led to a different site, which is not your own site, it could be a other article that you found somewhere and they would get pixeled, which is absolutely fantastic because not everyone is going to go to your website, right? So you can take third party articles and still have people be tagged with your pixel, which is pretty fantastic, right. So the example of my own blog was not the best actually because if they come to my website they would be pixeled anyway, but I could for example, make something super amazing, which I could then share on LinkedIn for example. People would click on that and even though they would go to Kendra's site, they would also be pixeled for me so I could show them ads on Facebook, which is pretty cool. 

Kendra:            Yeah. 

Christine:         Does that make sense?

Kendra:            Yeah, that makes total sense. That's awesome. So basically I can target anyone, even if I'm not sending them to my website or my stuff, I could be like, hey, like Christine Hanson's a sleep, sleep expert, she did this awesome video and then I can pixel them. That's crazy. I don't know why I'm not using this. 

Christine:         Yeah, because you can Kendra. I'm sharing stuff.

Kendra:            That's first thing I'm going to do, that's pretty awesome.

Christine:         But yeah, it's pretty fantastic, because then you could show them an ad and say, look, I know that you are interested in sleep. You could obviously work with this Christine, but I also help you with stuff like that, you know. So that would be fantastic, maybe no poaching clients from each other, that might not be the best example. But let's say I write an article on the Huffington Post, that I want to share on a platform that's not Facebook, and I know that the people going to be interested in an article will be interested in my services, then I would share that article with RocketLink and then I would target them on Facebook, which is a little bit creepy because people will say, how did she know I never checked her out on Facebook or on our website, but that's how dear people. 

Kendra:            Wow, that's very cool. Yeah, creepy from maybe a lay person perspective, but from an online marketer's perspective, that gives me tingles all over. 

Christine:         Yes, exactly. Exactly. Plus, it's cheaper because the people are already interested, you know, so it's going to give your ad a better ranking and lower cost, and that's what we're all about. So you can find all the info in our toolbox, which is for free on our website. So I head over there right now and download that. And with that we're going to start with our hot and steamy topic, which is poop. And everyone who is a little bit into how, will know that poop is amazing when it comes to helping figuring out what's going on with your health. And so let's take a look. And our first question is basically why is the gut important regardless of your niche? So Kendra I do different things, but both of us are absolutely poop enthusiast, fans, put it that way. I don't know the word know, but never mind and let's say, because the reason is that poop gives you such a beautiful and I don't know how to talk inside. 

Kendra:            Insight.

Christine:         And, yeah. So Kendra let's see. What is your number one reason why you adore having poop in the conversation when you talk with your clients? 

Kendra:            That is a great question. And the reason for that is just because like the gut is this massive system and it's the way that we digest. We absorb, we break down our food which eventually gets turned into minerals, into vitamins into all these things that we need for our body to run properly. So when people have symptoms, when their body's not working, you're going to find that the root of it might be in their digestive system and pretty much know I've worked with people with all kinds of issues, hormones, mental health issues, deficiencies, inflammation, autoimmune conditions, acne, skin health, all those things. And when we do gut testing, I mean I always see that there is a mess and when we clean up the gut, a lot of those symptoms will start to go away and you know, just to give it some perspective, like with hormones, like hormones are made, broken down, upregulated, downregulated and detoxified in the gut. So if there's hormonal issues, there's going to be gut issues. Same goes for neurotransmitter's. A lot of those are made in the gut. So if there's mental health issues, there's going to be gut issues. If there's inflammation, the gut is a massive source of inflammation. Autoimmune conditions are often triggered by infections. So, in the gut. So we really, I think regardless of who you're working with, whether regardless of your niche, if you're helping people with acne versus hormonal balance versus sleep, you do need to address what's going on in the gut or you might just be spinning your wheels and you may not actually get anywhere with that client and be able to help them. 

Christine:         Absolutely. And it's one of the first questions that I ask and I ask it kind of subtly way because people don't expect me to ask that when I talk about sleep, right. So they would go, well I get up at that time, that's my bedtime routine, and when I asked them about the bowel movements, they're just like, why would that be? Yeah, you're weird, you know, why do you want to know when I go to the toilet, you know, kind of have to explain it to them that the gut and the brain are literally connected you know, that there's the vagus nerve that goes from one to the other and that when that have information that creates a stress hormone. [inaudible] we do that. Then finally it makes sense, but it's up to us ask them about it and so it's absolutely true what Kendra said, whether you like me like sleep or whether you want to focus on skincare or whether you want to focus on hair loss, you have to look at the guide to make sure that it's in tip top shape because anything you will do from nutritionists, to supplementation, to even stress management, is not most likely not going to be [inaudible] in again. So we're actually going to talk a little bit about what we do, and also what we find are the biggest mistakes practitioners make when addressing the gut health in their client's. And I touched on it a little bit because, [inaudible] one of the first thing that comes up in a protocol is diet, right, and it all make sense because whatever you eat is going to go through the gut. So it does absolutely make sense to adjust [inaudible] and everything. And I totally agree. Absolutely agree. I think it's key building stone, but it's just not enough in our experience, right? 

Kendra:            Yeah, exactly. And I think, what I see a lot of practitioners do is they get people on these really restrictive diets, like long-term, but are really hard to follow and cause a lot of stress for people. And then that's all they do. So obviously you're right. Yep. Healthy whole foods diet, like free of additives, toxins, you know, allergens, yes you have to do that. But if that's all you do and you just get people on these really strict, like, you know, elimination diets for the long term, it may help, but it's probably not going to actually heal the gut, because I find, you know, if people's food sensitivities often go beyond just like, you know, the, the main offenders, like the processed and crap food, you'll find that sometimes people are having sensitivities to seemingly healthy foods. They're reacting to fruits and vegetables and meat or whatever. And that's not necessarily the cause of their gut issue. That's probably a symptom. And that's typically what it is. It's because the gut is broken down. They're lacking enzymes. The microbiome is a mess. They don't have hydrochloric acid in their stomach at a healthy enough level to break down protein, so all these undigested food is causing issues in their system and that's a symptom. So just pulling out the food sensitivities and getting those out of the system, sure it'll help reduce inflammation, but it may not actually correct the issue, especially when the main issue of their gut issues may actually be related to a bacterial imbalance, a dysbiosis or even an infection. Right? 

Christine:         Or parasites, the other. So, and those, that's why we a huge fans of testing just to make sure that we don't miss anything. The other thing is too, like if you use a diet that can be shaking, you know, losing any kinds of toxins, you need to be absolutely sure. First of all, that your client is also able to detoxify that so that the liver is actually in tip top shape and that they can absorb or make sure that they don't absorb whatever is going to be, you know, suddenly floating around. So I think it's, you know, having all these diets, especially detox diets and so forth, it's can be actually pretty dangerous. So really make sure that you do the prep work first, making sure that your client is actually up to speed or in shape enough to handle a diet like that too, right. So that's why I do like diets, but I don't do, make them too restrictive and I make sure that actually know what's going on in there. And so Kendra was already talking a little bit about this in microbiome and dysbiosis, and so people usually when I tell them well you probably, you might have parasites just because you see it in half of my clients and dysbiosis, I see pretty much everyone. They are pretty shocked. They're like, why? You know, I'm a clean person, I'm taking a shower every day and it's okay. So let's talk a little bit about why these gut issues might even happen in the first place, because it's just so difficult to imagine. It's this intestinal thing inside of you. It's seems well protected by several layers of skin, maybe fat. All cozy in there. So how can they actually get issues in this? So let's talk maybe about one of the first one of gut infections then is more Kendra's territory, and that is low stomach acid, and I think that's really your kind of stuff. So tell us a little bit about low stomach acid. 

Kendra:            Yeah. And before I get into that, I just want to just address something you said like that's definitely the biggest thing is that people are like, don't understand how they could have gotten these things and they think that they need to be traveling to a developing country or have really poor hygiene. But I think what people don't realize is we're ingesting thousands, if not millions of organisms on a daily basis through the food we eat through the air we breathe, the water we drink, like these things are everywhere and that's not a, that's not the issue. Like our bodies should be equipped to deal with a lot of these things. And our first line of defense is the stomach acid. So that's one of the main reasons people end up with infections is because they don't have a very acidic environment in the stomach or they actually lack the ability to produce stomach acid appropriately. So you want to have an acidic environment in the stomach because it kills off microorganisms. So it prevents those things from even getting lower into the GI tract. But there's a lot of things that could be going on that could be preventing you from producing stomach acid in proper amounts. The first two things that reduce stomach acid or stress and alcohol, right? Who's not stressed, who doesn't like to go out and get sauced on the weekend, right? Like a lot of us, we were in a big drinking alcohol consuming society, right? That will lower your stomach acid as well. Stress, right? Like these two things are everyday experiences, right? For most people. So that's probably some of the biggest ones. Proton pump inhibitors are antacids. You know, people have taken antacids because they're having heartburn. They think they have too much acid, but in a lot of cases it's actually they don't have enough acid, and that will suppress the acid issues further, and then there's a few that people don't know about very much at least I don't hear a lot of practitioners talking about them. One is hyperthyroid. Anything that reduces the metabolism is going to reduce the output of the stomach acid. Thyroid issues are pretty much like a pandemic in women days. Like I rarely meet a woman who doesn't have some sort of either primary thyroid issue or subclinical thyroid issue, and then the other two are copper toxicity and this is again, incredibly common in women. Most women I work with, me to. 

Christine:         Me included.

Kendra:            Most women I work with have copper toxicity. A lot of what I do is addressing the copper imbalance piece and what copper does is it actually lowers zinc and you need zinc to make stomach acid, so a zinc deficiency will lead to low stomach acid as will low sodium, which I think a lot of people are scared of sodium, we've been fear mongered about sodium, but actually 80% of the population has low sodium. That can be caused by copper toxicity, that can also be caused by stress, by dehydration, but sodium is a very, very important part of hydrochloric acid. So any of these imbalances are going to lead to that low stomach acid production. So that means now that you're ingesting these organisms, your body doesn't have its first line of defense to prevent them from getting lower into the GI tract. 

Christine:         Yeah. And then once they are there, you have a completely different kind of problem to deal with. Right? So, one of the first being that, you know, we talked about first line of descent, first line of defense being hydrochloric acid, but then you have your main immune system just underneath your gut layering. So if you imagine the different layers, the immune system is just below. So you can imagine that if that lining is basically compromise that your immune system is going to be flared up and you have tons and tons of complications, and that's where you get autoimmune diseases from because your immune system, somebody gets triggered like a crazy person. Lots of confusion happens. Our body is super, super smart, but it's not necessarily done or equipped for dealing with constant stress situations, so just creating a huge, huge, huge ton of chaos and it can take a lot of time to clean everything up again. I think having understanding that, that the gut and the immune system is so, so closely related is absolutely key. So you need to ask your client first of all, how they feel, what the digestion is like, constipation, bloated, diarrhea, all of that jazz. And then I find that, you know, very often like thyroid issues, it is an auto immune condition. You know, you find that there's a lot of connection or they would suddenly tell you, actually I have fibromyalgia or another autoimmune disease. So I often find that that comes together. And then last thing obviously that we're going to talk about because it's the big, big topic and it has been a huge topic in the last decade I would say is, gluten, right? So usually, and I'm sure when your health practitioner you have had that too, when you talk about gluten, people are like, oh, it's just a hype. [inaudible] hype, it just drives me nuts, right. The earth was flat too at some point. It doesn't mean that now it's right way around. That, that's a hype, right? So it's just ridiculous. But. So let's go a little bit through why gluten is a big topic, and I love that you said before, in an ideal situation you are super healthy and your body is totally equipped to deal with all kinds of stressors including gluten. So if you super healthy, eating gluten from time to time is not going to be a problem. However, if you have the stress load that we usually have, plus already something compromised, then gluten becomes a problem because it is not meant to be digested. It can't, and it's just literally going to punch holes in your intestinal lining. So Kendra, I think you can talk about this a little bit more scientifically and Geeky than I can, but that's basically how I explain it a lot of the time. 

Kendra:            Yeah, and I think, I think that's true. I think, you know, maybe back in the day when gluten was a different molecule than what it is today, people probably didn't have an issue tolerating it, but I know, and I'm going to get this, like my facts on this are going to be a little bit off, but I believe it used to be like a four or five chain molecule and now it's like a 70 something chain molecule, like it's been hybridized and you know, changed over time. And so now it's like that gluten component, that stickiness is much more. And so it's not really the same thing. It's not like we're eating the same wheat that Jesus was eating, you know, that's just not the case. We're eating something very different. And so it is very hard to digest and there has been research that has shown that ingesting gluten actually stimulate Zonulin. Zonulin is the protein that opens those tight junctions in the gut, that basically protect your GI tract from your bloodstream. So that may be that you eat gluten and then now things are leaking into your bloodstream. The other thing that I find really interesting is that farmers will actually dump round up, I’m sorry, roundup, which is glyphosate, which is a really, really toxic chemical that is put on crops. They actually dump glyphosate onto wheat, I think a few days before or a couple of weeks or a few days before harvest because it actually increases the yield. So, you know, it kind of begs the question like, are people actually reacting to gluten? Are they reacting to roundup, to glyphosate? So this toxin that has been shown time and time and again in research to destroy the gut, because what glyphosate does to organisms is it explodes their stomachs, that's what it does to bugs. So That's interesting, right? 

Christine:         Yeah.

Kendra:            Like what's it doing in humans if it has the ability to do that insects. So I think there's that piece as well. And so I'm definitely not in the camp that I think people, everyone's gluten intolerant and they're going to be gluten intolerant for the rest of their lives. But I think if you have gut issues, it didn't just happen, it’s been going on for a long time. By the time you have those symptoms of the gut, like the gut been healthy for months, years, even decades. So at that point your body has probably lost his ability to break down something like gluten, which is already difficult to digest for the average person. 

Christine:         Yeah, I totally agree with that. So I'm not sure about the roundup thing. I think it's not helping, imagining stomachs being blown up even as tiny as they might be, but we don't have the same one in Europe so. But still people react to it. So I think it is a huge contributor, it makes it even worse, but it probably not the only thing, but it's exactly as you say, if you were healthy it would be okay in a way, but because we are already so stressed and because stress is breaking down your intestinal lining, it's just adding to, you know, it's like oxygen fueling the fire, basically. And the other thing is, you know, people might believe in it or not, but whenever I tell people not to eat gluten, just to try it for at least three weeks, the difference is massive. Like you don't necessarily notice it when you don't eat it, but you do notice it as soon as they put it back into your diet and that's just. I had a client two weeks ago and she came back, I had never thought that nutrition would have to do anything with my energy levels, but I really now know my body, like I understand what my body likes to eat when it doesn't, that doesn't mean that, she eats it like she's like when I'm invited or when we have a fancy dinner, I will relish that pasta with gluten. I just know that I have to be close to bathroom, and I'm like good on you. But I mean it's, you know, that's the 80/20 rule, which I think is like 80% of the time we tried to do your best and 20% of the time it just screw it and you just go with it as long as that's, you know, as long as it's not doing anything severe, severe. I, I completely live by that rule. So. And that's what she said, you know, I didn't know. I just had no idea how my body was reacting to it and I think a lot of people should just do that experiment and see and I think that's, three weeks is something that everyone can do and if you do. So, I always suggested you tell your people exactly what they can eat rather than tell them, just make sure that you don't eat gluten, because that's so frustrating. Whereas when you them what to eat...

Kendra:            People don't understand what gluten is in.

Christine:         No. So when you can tell them what they eat instead, then it's much easier, because then they will go shopping and they will look for the stuff that you tell them they can eat, which is much more positive than having to look at everything and see what can I, what can't I eat, right. So it's just a mindset thing a little bit.

Kendra:            Yeah. And I totally agree with that. Like it's the one thing I can sort of pull from someone's diet where they will notice a benefit. But what's, what's interesting about gluten is that, if you are reacting to, and if your body is building antibodies towards it, any exposure to gluten will keep those antibodies elevated for up to six months.

Christine:         Yeah.

Kendra:            So if your person is gluten intolerant, like an 80/20 world may not work for some people, it's a problem. For people who are reacting to gluten, I mean, they just need to avoid it because I've seen people react, their antibodies be elevated on passing from gluten and they weren't even eating it. They were just maybe cross reacting from a cutting board that they were sharing with their husband or cheering cookware or maybe that gluten was in their shampoo. Even stuff like that. For people who are really sensitive, it's going to be a big deal. 

Christine:         Yeah. No, you need to know. You need to know. And that's also why we have our next topic, which is why testing is necessary to heal the gut. Like you could say, I'm just going to avoid gluten. I'm just going to have an anti-candida diet, for example. But for us, testing is always a super crucial step because we want to know what kind of infections are there and why. So Kendra maybe you can tell us a little bit about why just having, let's say if you have candida, just having the kidney diet it might not be enough and why testing is so important and also you know, inflammation and so forth. Why you need to know what exactly is going on in there? Yeah. 

Kendra:            Yeah. And actually I have a few things to say on the candida thing because it's actually kind of drives me crazy. Like I feel like candida, such a hot topic, it's like a trendy word and everyone thinks they have candida and they go online and they look at the symptoms and they self-diagnose themselves. Okay. I've got candida overgrowth. But the thing is, is like those symptoms for candida are the exact same for any other type of infection. So what you actually might be dealing with might not be candida at all. And then you go on this three weeks, candida diet and you're like okay, [inaudible] but yeast. But also other infections, like they're very opportunistic and they're very good at adapting. So if you starve, going super low sugar, low carb candida diet, that yeast might just start eating protein or fat, like they will just eat what they can. So, you know, a three-week candida diet isn't going to do it. And then if you do in fact have candida or yeast these infections are often secondary. So for example, candida lives naturally in the large intestines. It should be there, if it's overgrowing, the question is why, why is it overgrowing? It is because it can. So typically there is going to be another infection and diet isn't enough to make infection go away because they will just adapt. They will eat ketones, they will eat protein, they will eat whatever the hell they need to eat to survive, and they will just keep on living. And so the reason we like testing is because you want to know what you're dealing with, because depending on the type of infection you have, that might 100% effect the treatment protocol for your client. You know, for example, if they have H. pylori, that's going to be a completely different course of treatment versus if they have a parasite like blastocystis hominis or if they have a bacterial infection like c diff or if they actually have candida, like those are actually all different protocols and your client also might have all of those things. It's not just an exclusive thing, they're not mutually exclusive.

Christine:         No.

Kendra:            Like, and I see some of these panels that are completely lit up and people have parasites, bacteria, yeast, C. diff, H. pylori, and viruses and you're like, okay, it's gonna take us a year just to get through these protocols. Right? And I think, you know, with infections, especially like I have a lot of, a lot of people come to me after working with other practitioners who weren't able to help them. So this is a big reason why me and Christine are so passionate about helping you as a practitioner because people are not getting treated properly and they're going to other practitioners. So I, you know, I don't want you to have that experience, but a lot of practitioners will be like, okay, let's do this three-week parasite cleanse, let's do this, you know, four week thing and it may not be enough time. You know, certain you want to do on average two life cycles of that infection. 

Christine:         Yeah.

Kendra:            Typically, it's going to be about 60 days, sometimes it's actually going to be longer, right? 

Christine:         Yeah. I find 60, 90 days is usually like when I have them order supplements. So anything like that I usually take, take the biggest spot available and it's just do that, you know. 

Kendra:            Yeah, totally. And so... 

Christine:         Least 60 days. 

Kendra:            At least. Yeah. And so you got do these longer infection, these longer protocols. And the thing is, is, and this is again why testing is so important, you may not clear that infection in a client after the first round of treatment. Some things are very stubborn. They might actually adapt to your treatment protocol. 

Christine:         Yes.

Kendra:            So you need to retest, follow up and see if that infection is still there. And then this one really throws people off, sometimes on a retest, what you'll see is a whole new set of infections. 

Christine:         Yes, it's because you killed off, kind of the first line of defense, right. And suddenly everything is just like free in there, and it's just like, whoa, whoa, we kind of exposed here and we're kind of fighting for our lives and that's when they get detected best on these tests. You know, tests are great. They don't always pick up everything though, especially if you have a biofilm and that wasn't treated and advanced and it's tricky. So when you start treating, have the protocol, then everything starts to get basically released and it's like a whole mess in there. So yeah, I see that a lot too. 

Kendra:            Yeah. And I love that you just brought up biofilm because that's probably the primary reason why people are unable to get rid of their infections, because their practice share is not recommending a biofilm disruptor. And if you don't know what the heck we're talking about, you can think of it like Saran wrap or plastic wrap. It's this thin kind of translucent polysaccharide carbohydrate matrix that bacteria produce or parasites or yeast, back on your teeth is a biofilm, and they use it as this physical barrier, right? They kind of hide under it. And I've read that a bacteria hiding under a biofilm can resist antibiotics up to 2000 times versus something that's exposed. So you could be hitting it with herbs, but it's like under this biofilm and then even...

Christine:         Even with antibiotics, like you could even go through a round of antibiotics that is destroying everything living in there, but afterwards, when everything is eradicated and your natural police, as in probiotics has gone, then they're still there, you know, happy dancing underneath their biofilm. So you [inaudible].

Kendra:            You've just killed all their competition. 

Christine:         Yeah, and it's like hurray! 

Kendra:            Yeah. And the other, this is really creepy and I love, I love this, I love creepy things, but like the, they also use the biofilm as like a communication network. So they like talked to each other through it and they help each other adapt. So you need to break down a biofilm. So this is going to be a carbohydrate specific enzyme. Something like proteolytic enzymes, Interfase Plus is a product I use a lot, certain herb's will do it, N-acetyl cysteine on an empty stomach, like you need to give them something that's going to break that down, but this is also what can cause a lot of die off in your clients, right? Because within that biofilm are these infections, but also chemicals, toxins, heavy metals, a lot of stuff can get released on the biofilm. So.

Christine:         Clean it up. 

Kendra:            Yeah, 

Christine:         Yeah. I find that to you. And I usually talk about warfare when I talk to my clients.

Kendra:            Totally. 

Christine:         Break their defense. We're going to hit their shield. Then when there exposed we're going to come in with first batch, first cavalry, then we're going to come with the second team and we're going to fight them off, and help the probiotics, it's like a whole warfare kind of strategy session. But yeah, that's basically what it is. Aright, perfect. So let me just skip them. Ooh, juicy one. So we're going to talk, and here Kendra has to take over again because I have to say that's not my expertise, but I love the question, can you identify infections via blood chemistry? 

Kendra:            Woo, juicy question. So the answer is you can't identify specific infections, you do need a stool test to do that, but you can look at blood chemistry markers from a functional perspective. If you look at the conventional ranges you may not see it, but that can actually indicate that someone might have infections and they might need to do stool testing. So, the first thing you look at is the, the complete blood count or the CBC, if they have, say, lower high white blood cell count, if they have higher low neutrophils, low lymphocytes, high monocytes, or high eosinophils or basophils, if those are out of range that can actually indicate bacterial infections, viral infections, especially the eosinophils. Typically, if those are out of range when they're high, that actually indicates intestinal parasites. So you don't know what parasite they have, which you still do want to know because certain parasites need different treatment protocols. But that can actually, when you start seeing imbalances in the, the complete blood count, that's when you're like, okay, like something. 

Christine:         Yeah.

Kendra:            Something might be going on here, the immune system. 

Christine:         Yeah, and it's like a mock that's usually not really valued. 

Kendra:            Yeah. 

Christine:         Like traditional, like Western medicine. It's usually something that's on there but nobody really looks at it. So it's interesting when you look at it from this perspective. 

Kendra:            Yeah, and you see you want to be looking at it, the functional range. So I did put together a Freebie for this episode where I'm going to give you a little handbook and I'm actually going to tell you the markers and what ranges you want to look at to give you this indication, and this is really cool because even if you're a health coach, maybe you don't have the ability to order some of these functional tests, you can get blood work from your clients like they are already going to have that done in most cases they will have done it through their doctors through their naturopath. You can in, the US, you can send people to quest or direct labs and they can order their own blood work. I don't know if you can do that in Europe, Christine, but you can definitely do it in the US. 

Christine:         I think so, you probably, I think you can always do it, but it's going to be pretty expensive, but usually you don't have to, your GP will always say yes, like if you asked for, I don't know any GP would say, no.


Kendra:            Oh wow, I have to fight for it in Canada. Like I have to go in there and trick them. I'm like, oh, like I'm really cold and my hair's falling out.

Christine:         You’re kidding me.

Kendra:            And I'm fatigued, and I'm gaining weight, and they're like, oh, thyroid. I'm like, really? Oh my gosh, should we do thyroid testing? 

Christine:         You crack me up. Kendra you little minx. 

Kendra:            Yeah. Well it's, you know, when the government, the government pays for everything here, right? Our whole medical system is paid for the government, so they don't want to pay for anything, so you always have to really push it. But anyways, I digress. 

Christine:         Yeah, [inaudible] that's ok. 

Kendra:            So the other, this is actually a really interesting marker, and a lot of people don't know this, but high fasting glucose. So that's your blood sugar marker. And if you, I mean, so if you have a client who eats really healthy, maybe they're eating like a Paleo Diet and they're getting sleep and they're reducing stress and they're living a very healthy lifestyle, yet they still have high fasting glucose that is typically going to indicate an infection because sometimes it is of benefit, and I'm not going to go too deep into this because there's a whole other topic, but sometimes the body will make you insulin resistance on purpose because there's an infection and there was a lot of benefit that the body can get from that. So you know, you see this high fasting glucose or maybe your client has diabetes or metabolic syndrome and you're trying to give them herbs to help lower their blood sugar or increase insulin sensitivity. But actually you're fighting against what the body is trying to do on purpose. So typically you need to look for infections when there's high fasting glucose. The other one, there's a couple more I want to mention. So high ferritin alongside low serum iron levels. So iron gives us energy, but it also gives energy to infections. Parasites love iron, so ferritin is the storage form of iron, so sometimes the body is like,'Oh God, there's infections we need to starve them.’It'll start pushing iron into ferritin, into storage to sequester it from the infection, and then you're gonna end up with low serum iron levels and then of course your doctor's going to give you an iron supplement and it's not going to make you feel better and it's not going to help because you're just going to feed the infection. 

Christine:         Yeah. 

Kendra:            So, that's an interesting one. Elevated thyroid antibodies can tell you about that because typically thyroid issues are triggered by infections, so if there's an autoimmune process, there may be each H. pylori, there may be blastocystis, hominis. Those are really common with thyroid autoimmunity, and then finally high cholesterol and high triglycerides. Those can actually indicate H. pylori, which is a stomach infection, and also a primary cause of low stomach acid. So bringing it full circle. 

Christine:         Yep, this is golden, and don't forget that you get this [inaudible]... 

Kendra:            So that me on my soapbox [inaudible].

Christine:         It's amazing. Like I'm, my mind is the way to get cheat stuff actually because I need that when I look at my client’s blood tests that you can be like, oh... No, it's definitely a weak spot of mine. I've never really done any education on that in particular, but I find it's just, I feel so useless when I look at those lab tests, you know. So this is going to be super helpful. 

Kendra:            Yeah.

Christine:         All right, so testing as you've heard, we are huge fans. So when you do look at stool testing, which is, you know, in itself fun, there are different kinds of stool testing I think Kendra and I we both do, usually the same one, which is GI-map, but just to make sure that you know, what the differences are. So have PCR and we have DNA, right? So those are the two main ones that you can use. I only use one of them, so I'm not even sure what the other one does. 

Kendra:            PCR and DNA are the same test. A DNA test uses PCR, which is called polymerase chain reaction, which identifies the microscopic DNA of pathogens. And then the other one is the traditional stool test, which is microscopy.

Christine:         Oh God.

Kendra:            Come on Christine.

Christine:         Sorry, that was just like a very honest reaction. I'm like, what? 

Kendra:            So yeah. And they're like apples and oranges. So you actually can't, you don't get the same results from each of these tasks. And this is really important to understand. So typically if your clients come to you and they'd done a stool test most of the time, unless it's the GI-map or the DRG lab, I don't think there's, I don't, I'm not aware of what other companies are doing PCR testing, those are the most popular. Definitely the GI-map, but typically they're going to have done a microscopy test, which basically means that the stool goes to a lab. There's a lab tech looking through a microscope and trying to see what grows in a petri dish after 24 hours. So in order for you to get a positive result from a microscopy test, it needs to be alive so it can be grown and it needs to be present in large enough amounts to grow. So very good at picking up certain things, but the issue is not all infections thrive or survive outside of the body. They actually are anaerobic. So they need to be in an oxygen free environment to survive. Yeast is one of these, so typically you don't always see yeast on a microscopy test if you do, it means it's pretty bad, but a lot of these things will sort of self-destruct once they evacuate the body. So they're never going to be found on the microscopy tests because they can't culture it. And then you also need to have pretty abundant amounts of that organism showing up hopefully on the day that you actually took the stool test. So you are doing a microscopy past, you want to do a three or four day collection where you're collecting stool three to four days because they may not show up in large amounts every day. So, it is a good type of test for certain things, but it can miss a lot of things because there are a ton of infections you could have that or anaerobic, but also ones that might be there in smaller amounts and just don't get cultured. So... 

Christine:         Yeah. 

Kendra:            I used to run a traditional stool tests and I definitely had situations where I've had clients who had IVS and autoimmune conditions and a lot of GI issues, but their, their test was actually clean. I actually had the same situation myself. My original microscopy tests had infections. My retests was actually pretty clean. There wasn't really much on there. And then when I ran a GI-map, oh my God, it was a freaken disaster. I had one of the worst GI-map stool test I've ever seen. And so with, so with the PCR and DNA test, it actually takes the human component out. There's no lab tech. There's just a machine and the machine is, has a list of the DNA structures of these various organisms. It's more sensitive, but something to keep in mind is if the infection that you have is not on their list, that the machine is searching for... 

Christine:         It's not going to pick it up. 

Kendra:            Exactly. It's not going to pick it up. Versus the microscopy tasks can find anything that grows. So, you know, I would say in an ideal world with your client who is a millionaire and doesn't care about money, you would run both because then you'll get a really good picture. But that's, I mean, a lot of our clients don't want to run two stool test. I mean that's going to run them probably over a thousand dollars if not more. 

Christine:         Yeah, they are pretty expensive. 

Kendra:            Yeah. So that's why I actually do prefer the DNA, PCR test and that's the GI-map that you mentioned. 

Christine:         And I also find like, first of all, the GI, I did run the traditional one on myself, which is like, first of all, you need to be able to poop four days in a row, which for some people it's just impossible. I have a client who only poops twice every month, twice a month, every two weeks

Kendra:            Oh Jesus.

Christine:         Now we're on once a week. So we're super psyched. But yeah. So for her it would be absolutely impossible to do that. 

Kendra:            Yep.

Christine:         The other thing is that even if your PCR test doesn't pick up on everything, you would have so many different markers that will give you an indication that there's still something going on. So your, Escherichia Coli might be high, so you know, that's usually that goes hand in hand with having an infection. So even if it's not picking up on exactly the one that is on the list, seeing that and for example, marker that indicates that there's leaky gut plus having, you know, your immune system fared up, I will go and do an antibacterial protocol or even anti parasite protocol anyway, just for good measure. 

Kendra:            Absolutely.

Christine:         So just make sure if there's something there, it's not going to hurt you in any case, right. So when I have a feeling that there's still something going on and I have different markers pointing to a set direction, I was still implement a protocol. 

Kendra:            Yeah, absolutely. And I mean I love the GI-map because there's so many different types of infections. I mean it has a huge list of bacterial pathogens. It has tons of parasites on there. It has yeast, has a bunch of different strains of yeast, so not just candida. There's a few other strains. There are worms on there, worms were just added to the protocol, there's viruses, and then they have all their GI markers. So you can look at enzyme production, you can look at fat absorption, you can look at enzymes that cause estrogen dominance. You can look at the immune system, you can look at gluten intolerance, you can also look at leaky gut and inflammation. So there's just a ton going on, on this test. I would call it the Cadillac of gut testing. 

Christine:         Where I order it is around 300 pounds, maybe 310 pounds, which is like 500 bucks I would probably say, or maybe a little bit more, 600, 500, but I find it's really well worth it. And depending on where you want, again, you can cover, get it covered by insurance, so.

Kendra:            Yeah, some people with good insurance in the states, like obviously if you're in Canada you're not going to get covered. But some of my American clients who have good insurance, will get it covered. They can submit it to insurance, which is great. [inaudible] GI-map. I just want to let you know, in order to order it directly from the lab, like you do need to be a licensed practitioner. Me and Christine are not licensed, but we get it because we took the FDN course which we love and that gives us access to that. So if you're thinking about taking the course, do it, we'll put the link in the show notes because it's a great course and it has given us the ability to order pretty much whatever we want in terms of lab testing, right? 

Christine:         Yes. 

Kendra:            It's like you can also form a relationship, right? You can form a relationship with a doctor, with someone who is licensed, like an ND, naturopathic doctor and acupuncturist. They'll probably charge you a fee to order it, but you can typically get it through them or if, you can always contact us, we can also hook you up [inaudible] test with their clients. I do practitioner mentoring. So I train, I train a lot of people in understanding this test, how to interpret it, and what protocols that you should actually be putting in, depending on what you see. 

Christine:         Yeah, that's what I do with my mentees too. Like when I have someone, I mentor a couple of people in sleep coaching and I will, I always teach them that, and the Dutch as well. 

Kendra:            Awesome. Love it. 

Christine:         Alright, so I think we've covered pretty much everything. I think so. Yes. Kendra has put together an amazing guide. So she has a free GI-map interpretation guide, plus you have the blood serum free gift. So this is just like Christmas come early, we're in September. Just about today. This is going to be, I mean October, but it's literally like Christmas come early. Pretty much exciting. So if you went to say a thank you for all of this, then don't forget to leave us an iTunes review. And also we have the poopily magnet which is our gift [inaudible]. But if you think this is awesome, it's going to save you so much money. Just looking at it course like this would be a couple of thousand bucks easily. You can leave us a little thank you note on Patreon where you are a fan of ours as a buck a month, I believe. So if you want to do that then go to our website. You have a huge red button at the bottom where you can support us and what we do. And I think that is pretty much it for this episode. Did I forget anything?

Kendra:         Nope. I think that's everything. And so, I hope that was, I hope you guys love Poop as much as we do. We definitely love talking about this topic. Let us know. Let us know in our Facebook group, tag us on Instagram, LinkedIn, wherever we are, and just let us know what you want to learn about. If you want to learn more about poop, if you want to go deeper into the GI-map, if you want to talk about SIBO, like we definitely take requests. 

Christine:         Yes, absolutely. We're like your health practitioner jukebox. So, so this has been wonderful, Kendra. I've been learning so much actually. She's like the guru out there. [inaudible] No, it's been super fascinating, but what I can tell you is that you will change client's life. The reactions and improvements will come pretty quickly once a cleanup their gut, and it's not just the ones that put their focus on, they came to you, but their whole life is going to change, their energy levels, their weight loss, everything is just going to fall into place when you look at the gut. So, and at their poop. So it's, just, just do it.

Kendra:             Just do it.

Christine:         All right, well thank you so much guys. And we would see and hear and talk to each other in two weeks.

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