Archive Monthly Archives: August 2019

Biz Bomb – Top Tip for Increasing Engagment on Instagram

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Welcome to your latest Biz Bomb episode of the 360 Health Biz Podcast, where we drop a super quick and juicy tip on you that will make your head explodes from the excitement.

Today's episode is all around our favourite social media tool - Instragram! Instagram is the BIGGEST and BEST way to grow your social following (and business) of all the social media platforms. But with Instagram's algorithm, how can you be sure you're seen on your followers' feed and actually engage with them?

There are plenty of ways to engage on Instagram but there is one way in particular that works wonders AND creates that authentic human connection. What is it you ask?

As soon as someone follows you on Instagram, you want to engage with them right away. They are following you for a reason and WANT to learn more about you! And the best way to do this is to reach out to them directly.

Let’s back track though. Reaching out to ALL your new followers can take a lot of time…and let’s be honest, do you really need to reach out to Aunt Sally after she gives you a courtesy follow? The answer is no. What you want to do, is for each of those new follows, check out their profile and see if they fall into your niche market. If they do, then send them a DM (direct message) and personalize it even further by leaving a voice message rather than a standard copy/paste text message. Be sure to ask them a question so they have a reason to respond back.

If they respond, then that tells Instagram that they are interested in what you have to say and will put you high up in the algorithm to make sure they are seeing your content every time you post.

Does it seem weird to send a voice message in an Instagram DM? It might at first but a lot of people are surprised and grateful for them. It means you have a real voice on the other end of the screen. That the pictures you’re posting have a voice. It makes you authentic, and builds that human connection that everyone is dying to have on social media.

This is a great strategy for new followers and can be used to re-engage old followers that you haven’t seen posting on your feed. Scroll through your followers list and see if anyone jumps out that falls into your niche market. If they do, shoot them a DM with your angelic voice on the other end. You’ll likely be pretty stoked on the responses you’ll get.

If you like this episode, give us a 5-star review on iTunes and we will give you a shout out the next time we record. And don't forget to subscribe to our podcast while you're there!

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Screenshot this episode and share on Instagram and let us know your take and we will share it to our story. We also post all our Biz Bomb episodes to IGTV so be sure to follow @360healthbizpodcast and you can watch all the Biz Bombs!


Hey guys, how's it going? Welcome to your Biz Mom episode of the 360 Health Biz podcast. So this is the episode that we put out every other week that gives you a super quick, super juicy, mind blowing tip where basically it's like a biz mom. We drop it on your body, your head explodes because you are pretty freaking excited, okay? So today guys, I'm going to be giving you my top growth hack for Instagram.

Kendra: I love Instagram. Personally, I think in terms of social media for business, it is the social media platform with the biggest opportunity for growth. As of right now, if you guys are using Facebook, you kind of have to pay to play. You have to be running ads, you have to be very strategic, but the reason why I love Instagram is because you can still grow organically on it, and there are so many different ways that you can engage within the Instagram platform. Okay? But the truth is if you want to grow your following on Instagram, you can't just throw things out there and hope that it's going to stick. Okay? You have to be very intentional about what you're actually doing on Instagram, and like most other social media platforms, you actually have to build real human relationships on social media, okay? Marketing has really come full circle because remember back in the day, if you wanted to market yourself or market your business, a lot of that was actually going out in person and meeting people and shaking hands and having conversation and having these real meaningful human relationships. Really, marketing in 2019 has kind of come full circle, and now that's exactly what it is these days. You actually have to build those real human relationships, okay?

Kendra: So how do you do that on social media? How do you do that on a platform like Instagram? Well, there's a number of different ways you can do this, but one thing that I have found works super well is what I am about to tell you. Okay, so listen up. With Instagram, the most important thing is that once somebody is following you is that you actually show up in their feed, okay? Because you could have someone follow you, and then they might never see anything from you again depending on the Instagram algorithm. What you want to do is to get them engaging with you right off the bat. For all my new followers, for anyone who follows me where I feel like it's a really targeted person. My niche, my market is health coaches who are looking to bring their businesses online and looking to grow. They're online business, right? So if a health coach follows me, the first thing that I'll do is I'll go to their profile, I'll take a look, and I'll actually go into the DMS and I'll send them a voicemail.

Kendra: I'll just say something like, "Hey, this is Kendra. I just wanted to thank you for following me. Really, really appreciate that you took the time to do this. Just so you know, I'm creating some free content in regards to online business, and I would love to know what is your biggest struggle with building your business, because I will create some free content around that." It's really awesome because if they actually re-engage with you, so maybe they send you back a voicemail, or even if they text back to you, that actually tells Instagram that they like your stuff, so you are going to be way more likely to actually show up in their feed and they're going to be way more likely to see your stuff, which is the point, right? Especially if they actually answer your voicemail with another voice message. That is really engaging content. That is a very engaged person, and that automatically tells Instagram that, "Okay, this person likes this person's content, so let's show it to her more." They're going to see more of your stories and they're going to see more of what you are actually posting to your feed.

Kendra: On top of that, a voice message is very personal, right? People are usually really, really surprised, and they're usually really grateful. Sometimes they're like, "Oh my God, I can't believe you're messaging me. This is awesome," and sometimes they will be really excited to talk to you. I think not only does it help with help you win in terms of the Instagram algorithm, but it actually helps you build that genuine real human connection. A lot of the people who I've reached out with, we have actually had ongoing talks. Some of them I've made partnerships with, some of them have eventually bought my services, some of them will continually engage with my other content on Instagram, so it's a really, really valuable strategy. I think it works on a lot of different levels in terms of it helps you build that relationship, but it also shows Instagram that that person actually wants to engage with what you're putting out there.

Kendra: This is also a really good strategy to maybe re-engage some followers who are no longer engaging. If you feel like you have not much engagement on your Instagram account, maybe you don't get many likes, you don't get a lot of people commenting, maybe people aren't really responding to your stories, i encourage you to go into your follower list and start to reach out to the people who you feel like they are your ideal person. If you're a health coach and you work with female teachers, then you know you can usually tell if that type of person is following you. You can go and look through your follower list, find the people who you think are the most ideal people who maybe fit into that niche of whatever it is that you do, and reach out to them, send them a message and just say, "Hey, I just wanted to reintroduce myself to you. I know you followed me a long time ago. I'm looking to create some free content. What is your biggest struggle with weight loss? What is your biggest struggle with managing your autoimmune thyroid condition?"

Kendra: Whatever it is, go out and get personal with them and send them that voicemail. It can be a really, really great tool, and personally I think it has been one of the biggest tools that has helped me grow my Instagram account in the past six months. Okay, so do it. Let me know. Guys, if you like this episode, make sure to subscribe to our podcast, and if you like Instagram like me, you can screenshot this episode and let us know your take-homes on this episode and you can mention 360 Health Biz podcast, and we will share your story to our story. All right? If you want to see me talk about this video or about this podcast, we actually do these Biz Moms on IGTV, and it drops at the same time that it goes out on the podcast, so make sure to follow us @the360hHealthBizPodcast and check out her ICTV and engage with us. Leave us a comment and let us know what you learned. Let us know that you like this so that we know you want to get more content just like this from us.

Kendra: All right guys, I hope you found that biz bomb mind blowing, and I will see you again in one week with the next episode.

How to Date as an Entrepreneur with Ryan Flett

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Dating is hard these days. Through being an entrepreneur in the mix and it becomes even MORE complicated. As an entrepreneur and looking for love, you have to ask yourself the important question – do you want to date another entrepreneur or a 9-5 worker? While it may not seem like that big of a deal, It's hard for people who don't run a business to understand your passion and the fact that your business is your baby. This means that you work evenings and weekends, that money isn’t always flowing, and that your partner may not be your first priority.

In this episode, we get to hear the modern day romance of Kendra and Ryan, two entrepreneurs that have been making it work for the last three years. We discuss how dating another entrepreneur can be beneficial to your business. You can bounce ideas off one another, support one another as you know what the other person is going through, and learn from one another. But two entrepreneurs dating isn’t always rainbows and butterflies. Like most relationships, and boundaries need to be set and rules established (but sometimes broken). 

On the flip side to Kendra’s relationship, we also hear about Christine’s past relationship with a non-entrepreneur and where things didn’t go as planned. Again, like other relationships, money was a big factor….not to mention her turn ons include talking social media in bed and not everyone is into that.

Whether it’s a romantic relationships, friendship or even partnerships, we dive into communication skills and techniques that can be used across the board. Because it can be lonely as an entrepreneur and it's really important to find your people, or as Christine put it, find another zebra.

In addition to being Kendra’s love, Ryan Flett is also an outdoor adventure photographer, filmmaker, and educator.  Over the past decade, he has worked in the action sports and tourism industries but now has focused his sights on environmental sustainability, climate change activism and cultivating positive change through imagery, film, and community connection.

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Christine: Hello, everyone, and welcome back to this new episode of the 360 Health Biz Podcast. And today is a very special ones, because we're going to air our not so clean underwear. Very sexy though, [crosstalk 00:00:14] obviously.

Christine: Today, I have with me my beautiful cohost Kendra Perry, who I can't hit on her too much today because she's got her lovely boyfriend Ryan flat with her, because today's topic is about how you can deal, or how you can be in a relationship as an entrepreneur, and you might say a successful relationship. And we have two different stories, because Kendra is making it work, I didn't. Mine ended up in flames in a divorce, but it's a really happy divorce. So we'll be talking about all of this, about the different challenges that are there, the personal development things, just when you change and just, what we learned from this and hopefully it will help you or just make you feel less bad or isolated. Who knows? That's the way we are brutally honest. I'm looking forward to this.

Christine: So, Kendra, tell us a little bit about Ryan? What does he do? How are you both entrepreneurs? Because that's a little bit of a special one as well, both of you are actually entrepreneurs. So, we'll start off there.

Kendra: Maybe I'll start with how we met, because I think we have a modern-day love story because we met on Tinder.

Christine: Which is for me, just a getting laid platform by now. So, I don't know [crosstalk 00:01:27].

Ryan: Yeah.

Kendra: It may have changed since, and honestly, when I was doing the Tinder online dating, I was on a Tinder dating spree. I was just like, I want to date all the guys I want to have fun, whatever. I don't want a relationship. And I didn't really expect to meet someone, and we both swiped right. And I thought about it for a while, because I was like, "Oh man, he's super ginger. I just don't know."

Ryan: Just saying, my ex husband was ginger too. So there's a thing going on.

Kendra: Yeah. We love the ginger. Yeah. So we connected and then Ryan sent me this sweet, yet borderline creepy, message.

Ryan: It was to get your attention. It was like, "You ski? You cook? Marry me?"

Christine: I would have run. I would have been-

Ryan: I know.

Christine: Oh God, bye.

Kendra: I definitely was like, "Ooh, I don't know. I don't know." But we started chatting, and then we got together at a coffee shop, and as soon as I saw Ryan, he was very handsome, and I was like, "Oh fuck, I'm in trouble." But it was a little bit more of a slow burn for Ryan. I was in right away and it took Ryan a little bit longer to get on board. But I was patient-

Christine: Wow. [crosstalk 00:02:40] understand.

Kendra: I was patient, and he just wanted to take things slow and not repeat similar mistakes in past relationships, which I can respect, but obviously as an anxious attachment type of person, I was like, "Yeah, it's cool, it's cool." And then inside I was dying. [crosstalk 00:02:59].

Christine: Yeah, yeah.

Ryan: Yeah, because I'd had previous relationships where I jumped in full boar, and within a month it's hanging out together every single day, and [crosstalk 00:03:08] been eight years. So I was very aware of that. But it was very interesting to hang with Kendra because I hadn't had a partner who skied and climbed and biked and just enjoyed the outdoors as much as I did.

Christine: Yeah. [crosstalk 00:03:20] everything on past experiences. It's hard to let go.

Ryan: Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. And then our first real date after that coffee date was a ski date, because we'd both been raised on skiing, and it was to check each other out because for both of us it's a huge part of our lives, and I'm looking over my shoulder being like, "Okay, she can ski." And she was doing the exact same thing too. You're like, "Okay, this guy can ski. We can move forward with this a little bit."

Kendra: Yeah. Exactly. We had to check out each other's skiing skills and then, yeah, we dated for a while, and things progressed slowly. I think we made it exclusive a few months later, and then at one point, maybe around six months, I just told Ryan, I'm like, "So you're my boyfriend now. That's what I'm telling people, and that's the way it is."

Christine: He rolled with it.

Kendra: Yeah.

Ryan: Assertive.

Kendra: Yeah. I was like, "This is what's happening." And then I think things got really serious for us probably around the eight or nine month mark after Ryan left me for seven weeks, I think, he went to Nepal. I was like, "Yeah, go have fun / I'm dying inside." [crosstalk 00:04:27] But he went to Nepal, and I think he ... what did you do? A silent Buddhist meditation retreat?

Ryan: Well, I did intro to Buddhism, which was a little bit of silence and meditation and teachings of Buddhism over 10 days. And yeah, dealt with some pretty significant things that were going on my life, and it was definitely the changing point in my now current life, it was definitely that trip.

Ryan: So, yeah, I came back and Kendra was very enthralled with how I was acting. And since then-

Kendra: There was a definite shift. I was like, "Okay, the walls are suddenly down. I have no idea what the fuck happened in Nepal, but the walls are down, and this is good."

Christine: Everyone, send your guys to Nepal. There we go.

Kendra: Yeah, exactly.

Ryan: Yeah.

Christine: Meditate. Go figure out [crosstalk 00:05:17]-

Ryan: Go meditate and think about stuff for a while, and be quiet for a bit.

Kendra: Yeah. It's something we don't do that often. But yeah, after that, we exchanged I love yous and then Ryan asked me to build a house with him, and that's now what we're currently doing. I think we're at three and a half years together now and yeah, we're building a house, our dream house, should be ready soon. And we've both been entrepreneurs from the start of our relationship. Although at the beginning of our relationship we are in very different places. I was new in my business, and I was broke, and I was in early entrepreneur struggle town whereas Ryan was more established.

Christine: So what did Ryan do? Maybe we should actually tell people.

Ryan: Appreciate it. Appreciate it. [crosstalk 00:05:55] Absolutely.

Ryan: I'm a professional photographer and filmmaker, primarily in the outdoor adventure and environmental industry. I've been skiing and camping and all that my entire life, and I found a way to merge my lifestyle and my work. When I was about 22 years old, I was always obsessed with taking images. So since 22 I started working for different themes, all in outdoor adventure, primarily around skiing, and about when I was 30, 29, I got a job back near Nelson here and that's about the same time I met Kendra. And that's what Kendra referred to as, when she was on the low money spectrum and the real hustle time in her business, I had this consistent thing for about four years, so I was more of a support for Kendra to be like, "Hey, you have to push through this. You'll be fine. You just have to keep going."

Ryan: And now those roles have been flipped, because Kendra has gone through those three or four years of growth and consistency, and then I quit that solid ... It was a contract, but it was almost a job. And then I quit that a year and a half ago, two years ago. And I have my photography business, which is my own sole proprietor business. And then I also have a film production business with my partner Bohdan Doval, but it's also all around film production.

Ryan: And now I'm a photographer, a filmmaker, a producer, a director, and generally the person who just makes shit happen. That's really what I do. I mean I make shit happen.

Christine: Founder, administrator, all of these things. I mean, that's what comes with all of it. When we say our job titles, it's not just that, what we do, we have to run this whole boat of things.

Christine: So yeah, I think it's super interesting because you both started out that way and then roles reversed [crosstalk 00:07:51] you started out with the same kind of foundation, and I think that's maybe the biggest difference, because, well, I met my husband, I was 27, so we were together for nine years, but I had a very different life at the time. I had a full time job. I never thought I'd be an entrepreneur.

Christine: So we got married and had kids and had perfect house and everything was fine, and it's still fine. I could still be with my husband and it'd be fine. However I'm a not fine person in a way, so I think through the personal development, I've just changed so much, and I just didn't know. I didn't know who I'd become and how much I'd changed. I think the biggest difference, and we might be talking about that too, because Kendra and I are very different in that area, is money, and a big, big problem to me. And my husband was money because that was when we would get in fight. And it's not like it drained our bank account; it was always fair. But I remember very clearly that I started to do my personal development and I really realized how I was changing and how I was growing, and how he has this restrictive traditional money mindset.

Christine: And then [crosstalk 00:09:02] where it really sparked was when I did my first 10K sale and then told him and his reaction was, "Oh, okay." And it was taking those wings and clipping them brutally, [crosstalk 00:09:15] back bound to earth, and that killed me and I was, "I cannot do this." And as it happened I met other people who understood exactly what I was doing, who also understood the work, because I think it's very hard if you are not an entrepreneur yourself to understand the struggles, and you referred to Kendra in the beginning being in those ups and downs, nobody who's not going through it will understand what that feels like.

Christine: And then finally reaching that point where you are like, "I made it, or at least I think I made it."

Ryan: Yeah, I think I made it.

Christine: Exactly. That enthusiasm, and then having put the brakes on, that's not ever going to let you fly, so that there were other issues too. But I think that was for me, the biggest, biggest problem, that I'd not see myself grow. And it was a question of am I going to lead my life and do what I want to do or not, because I couldn't do it with him.

Christine: We had a very peaceful divorce, I have to say. I left in October, we got divorced in April, we're going on holiday with our daughter together this summer, we see each other every day. So it's beautiful. I always say I have the best ex husband in the world, and definitely the best dad to my daughter. [crosstalk 00:10:28]. But I couldn't make it happen.

Christine: I always proud of myself that we communicate, and I think it crept up on me just as much as it did on him. But the differences, I think, through the personal development journey, I learned very quickly what I want, and that it's clear. And that way I knew that when I took the decision there no way back. And he knew it too. We never argued. That was never really a try to make things work again and to fix things because it was just, he knows, okay, there's nothing I can do, which he was right on.

Christine: But I think that's the biggest challenge when you are with a non entrepreneur.

Kendra: Yeah. I think it's a big challenge. It's hard for people who don't run a business to maybe understand the passion and the fact that your business is kind of your baby, right? You put everything into it, and-

Christine: More. I would argue more than your baby because it is how you nourish your baby. [crosstalk 00:11:26] my daughter, my business is the way that I can help her live, basically. So it's a lot of pressure on it, and so I think that's a big, big, big difference.

Ryan: Yeah. I feel really fortunate that we had that connection early on. I come from [inaudible 00:11:45] that's more content and visual, and I thought I knew all about social media. And then the first three weeks we Kendra, I was, "Holy, I barely know anything. And Kendra's so granular and you go micro. You understand the macro, but you go really micro. And I think the sports that we participated in and was one chunk of our relationship, and then another big part of it was back and forth about business and supporting each other, that flow of ideas. And that has continued. Sometimes we have a, actually, we do have boundaries with that, because obviously we have to set those, but it's gone really well because I wouldn't be at the place in my business right now if it wasn't for Kendra, and we've been able to support each other, and you understand those highs and those lows. I was talking to Kendra about it last night, where if I'm down and whatever's happening, she's like, "You know what, you're super talented. You gotta keep on going. I empathize with where you're at."

Ryan: And that makes it so much easier versus previous relationships would be like, "Why aren't you making money? What are you doing?" And this struggle and this growth that takes time. I even tell my business partner this, I'm like, "You know what, we're at the very beginning, and this is totally normal what we're going through." And just to have that, and from what I am learning with Kendra and I, I then take that to other clients, other partnerships to be like, "Okay, this is how you foster this relationship and understand what each person is going through."

Christine: Yes, I agree. It's a learning curve for sure, and I just feel like, for me a requirement now actually for the next relationship at some point is to be with someone who gets that. I don't think, I don't want to, first of all, I wouldn't be with someone again who has a 9-to-5, because I just know I would run into the same problem again.

Christine: [crosstalk 00:13:43] me curious, if you listening out there and you have that relationship, how are you making it work? Because I didn't. You guys are both entrepreneurs. I'd love to see how you can be happy and fulfilled in your marriage or relationship when you do have that. I wish I could have made it work, but at the same time I met at much better place now, so I on't really, in a way. I wish I could've avoided it, let's put it that way. But everything happens for a reason, I guess.

Kendra: It's true, and I think it definitely probably is more challenging, and I think most people who are listening to this, most entrepreneurs who listen to our podcast are probably in more of your style of relationship. I think it's not super common that two entrepreneurs are together, and yeah, we'd love to know. Send us an email: and let us know, because I think it is challenging and I think the other partner who's not the entrepreneur does struggle to understand maybe why you're working in the evenings or working on the weekend or why you go through these highs and lows, or maybe the money stuff. I think that's really interesting that that was such a big issue with you, because, yeah, people have a lot of messed up relationships about money, and when you're an entrepreneur you have to really work on your money mindset and believe in abundance, and you have to be motivated by money to some degree. You can't just be like, "I want to help people. I want to do this." The money has to be a part of that.

Kendra: And some other people, the 9-to-5 people, they may think, "Oh well, that's greedy."

Christine: Yes. That was the problem. When I was seeing a beautiful new Tesla, I was like, "I want one of these." And my ex would just say, "Oh, I would never get in that car with you. That is so embarrassing. It's such a show-off." I'm just, "Stop judging those people. You have no idea what they did to get money, how they work. That's not to say that everyone who has money sold their soul or is selling drugs or [inaudible 00:15:34] little kids." I think that's still ingrained in so many people, and if you are an entrepreneur and you have someone around you, even if they don't mean it, they are not aware of this, most of the time, it's not they mean it negatively, but they never need to ask themselves these questions about money. They don't have to do that, work in order to not just attract money, but actually be okay to receive it and to ask for it without feeling horrible.

Christine: And so you're just in very different places. And I'm not sure if you can ever get there if you have someone who you live with or you spend your life with constantly shitting on that.

Ryan: Yeah. And I found, even in growing up with my family, my mom was a nurse, my dad worked for the government, my sister's a teacher, they're in that consistent paycheck, get a job, do that thing. And that was always what I was pushed to be, like, "This is how you'll be successful and you'll live your life." And I was like, "I don't want to do that. I want to do what I want." And I had a lot of years of it being really tough. And I remember saying to my parents one year, I was 21, right before I got my first big photography job, and they were like, "Why don't you go and get a job in this?" I'm like, "No, I have to do this for me. My happiness is number one and what I love the most, I'm probably going to do the best." And I've stayed with that. [crosstalk 00:16:59]. Yeah. Definitely. Definitely will do the best.

Ryan: And so now, 10 years in, I keep saying that to people, and Kendra and I, we constantly talk to our friends about businesses and entrepreneurship because they'll all have an idea and we're like, "You should lean into that, even if you start just doing an hour a week." And some of them are like, "Oh, I need my consistent paycheck, and I respect that," but then there's some people who right away think, "Oh, I can't do that." And you go, "No, no, no, you can. It takes time and you can just incrementally chip away at it.

Ryan: But for Kendra and I, I find that Lisa, this is from my perspective, is that our businesses have been increasing because we've constantly had that interaction back and forth of, I guess, you can bouncing off each other and go, "Oh, how about this way you think about this?" And Kendra's really helped me with my writing, and I've helped Kendra with her imagery and website, and like I've said previously, I wouldn't be where I'm at without Kendra.

Christine: I absolutely believe that. I mean, I think we all need this bouncing bag, especially in a partnership. And I think there's nothing, honestly, there's nothing more sexy than being in bed and talking social media or marketing.

Ryan: Yeah. Tell Kendra about that. I don't fully believe that, but Kendra a 100% believes that.

Kendra: That's my foreplay.

Ryan: Oh, my God.

Christine: Exactly. It's a total turn on for me too, having someone go and I tell them, I had this algorithm, or we saw this statistic, or I've just read this article on SEO, and someone going, "Oh yeah, what did it say?" It's like, "What?" I'm swiping right.

Christine: But even knowing what that means, or, I don't know, email funnels or client onboarding or all these things that dominate your life and that excite you, because when you're figuring it out, it's so exciting. So, I mean that is, I think what I am, if you're listening out there, I'm single.

Ryan: That's what I like.

Kendra: Just coming back around to this idea of the person you're with or even your family members not understanding, I think that's the most important thing to keep in mind is they want you to be safe. They want to protect you, and in their opinion, they don't understand running a business, and that's not a safe option to them, especially there's a lot of negative words around running a business. I always hear this statistic thrown around that 95% of small businesses fail [crosstalk 00:19:25]-

Christine: Oh yeah. I hate that.

Kendra: When you break it down, I don't think that's really true. I think it has to do with people refiling taxes, and that could mean that they changed their business structure or they changed their business or they weren't into it. There's just so many reasons why somebody would refile their taxes for their business. But I think it's a scary thing. And the reason why your partner or your family or your friends don't understand and are confused, is not because they don't support you. I think it's because they want you to be safe, and what we're doing isn't a safe option, and it's not for everyone.

Ryan: Yeah. And I think society in general, you look at a job as this, you get it and you have a job. Whereas you run a business, that 95% of businesses go under, well, it's so many different levels. Someone could have just started something and gone two months and done a little bit of research but then backed away on it, because it's so much more of a journey and personal development and growth. It's not like, oh, not job, job. It's so much more than that.

Ryan: And most people don't understand that. I'm constantly telling people, because it looks I'm always out in the mountains, they're like, "Oh, you live this amazing life." I'm like, "You know what, I probably spend just as much time on the computer as you or probably more because I work six or seven days a week, but I also love what I do." And people are like, "I don't know how you do it," but I'm like, "When you get into the small things, it's similar." I'm doing admin, I'm emailing, I'm contacting. So it seems this amazing thing always and it's not. It's always a balance. It's always a balance of different things.

Ryan: But I find that it clicks my brain on, whereas a job clicked my brain off. I just got into a system and now I don't want to be in systems. I want it to be different and creative and always looking in new directions. And it's also on me. It's accountability. I've taken that spin of this is all on me and anything that happens in my business is on me, and that makes every single situation and every single conversation so much easier.

Christine: Exactly. And it's a lesson learned in case it doesn't work. Kendra and I were even talking about this. Sometimes you meet at another zebra [crosstalk 00:21:54] a lot of entrepreneurs being zebras, they're just different. And when you have a conversation with them, when you talk about these things, suddenly you see that spark in their eye, and it's like, "You're one of us."

Christine: I really literally think you don't always know that you are, you just feel something's off. But very often life is so comfortable that you don't notice. And it's one of the things when I talk to people, and I did a podcast recently, and it's called Just Say the Word, and you had to find one word. And my word was loneliness. And it's not that I'm a lonely people. I wouldn't consider myself emo, or anything that. But when you do do that journey, you change, and it is isolating because you start gaining new people who are 100% yours because they get to know you when you are you, but you also lose a lot. And it's not to be negative, but I just want to say that when people do figure out, oh I'm a zebra, I really want to do this. And when they start tapping into who they are, to be aware of that and that you are changing. And it might be that you are losing people, and if you are in a relationship, tell your partner that.

Christine: And I remember that last year, we were on the beach, family vacation, very picturesque, sun, beach, everything, and I was doing tapping exercises, and my husband was just like, "You're so embarrassing, sitting on the beach, tapping around and everything." And I was like, "I know it. It works." And I'm not sure if he particular would have understood, but maybe someone else in a relationship would actually be, "Okay. Tell me more about this." And I think probably what I do different now is to really say, "You need to listen to me. You need to understand what this means to be me." And even if they don't completely, I think having them try is probably enough.

Kendra: Yeah. And I think it's unlikely that you're going to find another entrepreneur to be with. But I think you just need to find someone who understands and can show interest and be supportive, and maybe you just need to be very upfront with what it's like, right? Because it's very up and down. It's very roller coaster, you're very emotionally attached to it and you have a lot of highs and lows. But I feel like maybe everyone's like, "Oh, it's so great. Kendra and Ryan are both entrepreneurs, they understand each other," and it's true. But there are still challenges being two entrepreneurs. Our struggle has been finding the boundary.

Christine: So what once you do give us some specific ...

Kendra: We have a few rules that we-

Christine: Just to get [inaudible 00:24:33] we are sharing the wall to my right, and I can hear [crosstalk 00:24:37]. I can hear the audio. That's why I have the big headphones on. Just to get the spatial awareness of where we are. Sorry, Kendra. Go for it.

Kendra: Well I was just going to say we've had to implement a few rules, which we do break occasionally, but we're trying to get better. For one thing, when the door is closed, you can't come in, because before we just burst into each other's office and the person's focusing and we're like, "Blah blah blah blah. I need to talk about this. Social media, blah blah blah. Groceries. The bathroom's dirty." Whatever. And it's just like, okay, this is not okay. We can't do this to each other. So we have this rule now, and we've gotten a lot better, occasionally it still does get broken, but when the doors close, you're at work, you can't come in. And we literally will Facebook message each other and be like, "Hey, do you have two minutes to talk?"

Christine: That's like a secret knock. ... urgent.

Kendra: Yeah. So we try to respect each other's space like that, and this is something we need to work on too, but we've tried to have a, after 6:00 PM rule, no business. Let's not just talk about business. Let's connect about other things. Let's go do things. Let's get out of the house and not talk about Facebook.

Christine: I agree. Yeah. I think that's awesome. That's an awesome rule.

Ryan: Yeah. And it's been helpful, because we were breaking those boundaries and it was causing disruptions and also an understanding of this is my space and I'm working in here and I'm getting whatever done, and I need to focus. And for both of us, we would sometimes come in and be like, "Oh, this crappy thing happened." And all of a sudden our day just gets thrown off. You Go, "Oh, okay, now I'm thinking about that, and I feel bad, or that I'm not doing enough," or whatever. So it's better now, and when we're in our new house, Kendra will have an office upstairs, and I have an office downstairs, and Kendra got the upstairs office because she's behind her computer in her office a lot longer than am, which I think is totally fair, but to have that separation, I think, will be better.

Ryan: And then [crosstalk 00:26:49] I'll build an office, probably 12 by 12 office up in the forest, a hundred feet away from the house to really have that separation, to really feel like, oh, that's my workspace. And I think that's-

Christine: I love that, yeah.

Ryan: Yeah. Yeah. But still coming back and connecting. We cross over at lunch time and we'll if we have any quick questions for each other and then we're going through, we'll just touch on it quickly and then we go back to our work. But yeah, that spatial separation I think has been helpful, especially because this is the first time we've really done this.

Christine: Yeah. I like this rules that you don't open the door, you just know spatial separation. I think that's all amazing, and also you know that you support each other when something goes wrong. I know Kendra is the biggest champion. She's been that for me too. [crosstalk 00:27:38]-

Kendra: "Nothing's working."

Christine: Like, "I believe in you. You're so awesome." "Okay, I am."

Ryan: Yeah, yeah.

Christine: I have to say my ex was supportive too, because I had my meltdowns too. And he would just say, "You always make it," and he's right. You always make it. And he was right. It's not that he wasn't supportive, it was just a bigger mindset kind of thing. But yeah. Oh, it's so interesting. I'm taking notes for future Mr. Perfect [crosstalk 00:28:08].

Ryan: And I did find that the small breakdowns that we each have, if we didn't have each other [crosstalk 00:28:20]. Oh, yeah. And I feel like, especially in the past, that those breakdowns for me would have been longer. They would have stretched a longer span of days. Whereas I can voice what's going on and I think Kendra can reflect this as well too, but I can voice what's going on and then Kendra and empathize with it and then be like, "Oh no, you're going to be fine. I've gone through this and dah, dah, dah, dah, dah." And it just shortens that period to be like, "Oh no," next morning I'm like, "Oh yeah, I'm totally fine."

Christine: That's really great.

Ryan: Yeah, because I had, once again, so once I'd bounce ideas off. So simple, but ...

Kendra: It's really important to find your people as an entrepreneur, because it is really isolating. When you said loneliness, it is very lonely. You work from home, you work in front of your computer. And that's why me and Christine connected quite quickly, because we were totally on the same wavelength we had a lot of the same goals. And it's funny that we're so close because we're actually incredibly different. We're very, very different. We differ on some really big foundational stuff-

Christine: Money being one of them. But it's still works. It's weird.

Kendra: Yeah. And just even you're the glam city girl, I'm the mountain girl. You live in the ocean. I live in the mountains, but we connect on that business thing and when we hung out in San Diego in March, we had so much fun. It was great. [crosstalk 00:29:43]-

Christine: ... forever. And I love our Atlantic session. I love having a 14-minute Box from Kendra and I'm just brushing my teeth. ... I'm like, "Uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh." [crosstalk 00:29:56].

Kendra: You've gotta find your business besties, whoever that is, and they may be people who are online. And that's typically how it's going to be depending on where you live. I know where you live. There's not a ton of entrepreneurs and we're in a small town, so we don't have that many either. But, find your business besties, you need a business bestie. You really do.

Ryan: Yeah. Even in comparative industries. For me, I've been around a lot of athletes. I've been around filmers, lodge owners. I'm not lonely in my business. It's not as many entrepreneurs, but I've had people to constantly chat with or go over things with and be open minded to be like, "Oh, I wouldn't even have thought about that." And a big thing for myself in entrepreneurship is, now, I always try to come from the standpoint of trying to understand my customer clients, and how I can bring them the ultimate value. And that has made every single situation way better. And I have all these people, like all these marketing managers being like, "No one has asked me what I wanted in two years."

Christine: That's [crosstalk 00:31:09].

Ryan: Yeah. And even two or three years ago, I wouldn't have thought, because I'm thinking, oh what do I want to do? I, I, I, and now I come from like, "Hey. I want to understand you." And right away, that just opens people up to be like, "Oh wow, oh, oh you want to know what I want? Really?" And it also makes it easier for me, because I understand what they want and then I write them a proposal exactly for what they want. And I had two previous contracts over this last month where I said some key words because I really interviewed these marketing managers or general managers and I was having a meeting with them. They were like, "You just read my mind." They're like, "You actually just read my mind perfectly."

Ryan: And it seems a trick, but it's just being open minded and really understanding of what the value I can bring someone, which most entrepreneurs don't really do. It's like, "I this, I that." That's not what rocks the boat.

Christine: It's so interesting because I think Kendra and I, we do coaching inherently, but I do totally agree that in, especially in the creative industry or anything like that, it's very often the case. And even if your clients are something where you're just like eye roll, you can manipulate it in a way that they stay [inaudible 00:32:24] that it's what they wanted and we can still make it work.

Kendra: Yeah. And I think it just comes around to serving your people, right? Knowing what they want, because in the end we need to be of service as coaches. Me and Christine are coaches and we serve people, and yeah, that's really where it needs to come from is like what do they need? What do they want? what are the words that they use, which is what Ryan is doing just in a different industry. He's listening. He's like what are the exact words that they use and the things that they want, because in the end you had to make it about your customer, your client, and not about you.

Christine: Just this conversation that we have here is something that I never had, because even if I just used the word client with my ex partner, it would feel really weird for no reason. I just feel it off. And also because we got to know each other when I wasn't [crosstalk 00:33:18] clients, when I wasn't "selling myself," but yeah, that's what I do. So I think it's so weird. It's natural now, but it's so strange when you change that way. It's really strange.

Ryan: Yeah. And I find another big change has just been asking, constantly asking. I'm in an industry where people want to work with these big brands, and they're like, "How do I get it?" And people think that you build a website and you put some stuff out there, they're going to come to you. And I had that mentality for a long time, and now I'm in that I chase, and I try to understand, and then I pitch. [crosstalk 00:33:58]. Yeah. And always coming in and thinking of how do I bring value and where do we align? And I use that a lot. I find our ideals and our morals and our goals align. I'd love to collaborate, and I always say in emails, "I want to see if I can bring you any value."

Ryan: And it's also not marginalizing myself. I say, "Hey, I do great work, but I don't fit with everyone. But for the clients that I do click with, we can create absolutely amazing things together." And it puts the standpoint where it's a little bit of an ego, but it's also being like, oh, I just won't take all work. It's going like, "I want to find who works well for me because I have a certain set of skills that I can give you, but I want to make sure that we're on the same path, because that is going to be the foundation of creating great work together."

Christine: Great. Great. Yeah, that's amazing.

Kendra: Yeah. And Ryan does create fantastic, fantastic work. He's very talented.

Ryan: Oh, thanks [crosstalk 00:35:00].

Kendra: It's like who's this woman? Oh, it's Kendra. No, I'm kidding.

Ryan: Yeah, yeah. She's my main model. She gets a lot of Instagram imagery out of that. Don't you, babe?

Kendra: Yeah. I do. And you've really helped me edit my photos. I get a lot of compliments on my photos and that they look cohesive and they're really nicely edited and I owe that to Ryan. He's really helped me. And I do it all through phone apps, iPhone or Google apps, so it's awesome.

Kendra: If people are into outdoor photography, if they want to see your work, Ryan, where can they find you?

Ryan: You can check out my main website, which is or you can check out my Instagram, is @ryan_flett, F-L-E-T-T. That's the best way to look for my work. And also my film production company, which is, A-L-T-U-S Collective. And that's my newer film production company. And yeah, that's more of the road that I'm going down. And I find that that stream is opening up a lot of doors, because I'm not pigeonholing myself into just photography, but I'm coming from a standpoint of ... I'm an extrovert, obviously, and I like to control, I'm quite self aware that I like control, but I've been able to harness those and be like, okay, I understand the visual side. I really like organizing, I like to have some control, but I want to be able to create a great product for people.

Ryan: So I find, with my business partner and other clients, where I fit best and also being very aware of my strengths and weaknesses, and my partner is more of an introvert, but he's extremely talented filmmaker, and he's a little bit more reserved but I try to empower him as much as I possibly can, be like, "Hey, you're the expert in this. This is what I think, but I want to hear any feedback you have or any new ideas or anything." And fortunately we're both fairly level headed and have these great conversations. One thing we really do is every project we get, we evaluate if we're on the right path, because we don't want to [crosstalk 00:37:26]. Yeah. And I think this is a thing with entrepreneurs that I've talked to where you know you need to make money, you need to go off tangents to grab money, but as you continue on, you don't want to keep doing that and then being spread so thin on this way and you're not known for anything.

Ryan: So we're making sure that we're on a defined path with our vision and our goals and we constantly reassess and be like, "Is this something that's carrying us forward towards our goals?"

Christine: Perfect. I think that's incredibly important, because there's a lot of opportunities that are really not opportunities in disguise. They're really going to help build someone else's business and not yours. And I think in the beginning you say yes to everything, but like Ryan said, you got to figure out what's your ultimate goal and what's actually going to move you forward and learning to say no. That is actually really empowering, even though it's like, well that's going to make me money but it's not quite what I want to do. So that's a really nice way to tie things up.

Ryan: Yeah. Absolutely.

Christine: Yeah. So a future Mr. Christine, if I'm making money with you, I'm kidding. Am I? I don't know. Maybe.

Kendra: And you guys should check out the YouTube video because Christine's in a super sexy shirt. So all you [crosstalk 00:38:39] rich entrepreneurs out there check out the video [crosstalk 00:38:43] on our YouTube channel areas. But it's so hard. These guys are in ski costumes and I'm [crosstalk 00:38:51] we use outside and just want to tell everyone.

Christine: All right, well thanks so much Ryan for hanging out with us today. It's been a [crosstalk 00:39:00] conversation, we really appreciate it.

Christine: And, guys, as always, we love Instagram. So if you are listening to this episode, take a screenshot, share into your stories, make sure to mention 360, help his podcast and let us know your biggest take home or what your favorite part of the episode was. And then we will share it to our stories.

Kendra: Or tips.

Christine: Tell us how did you make it work? How did it not work, what is your lesson? We want to know that stuff, because obviously you don't know everything so you can teach us a lot too. Or if you have a single friend, it's fine.

Kendra: Just send all your single friend photos to hello@360healthbiz [crosstalk 00:39:39].

Ryan: Watch out for that.

Christine: All right. With that, we're going to call it a day, so you can check everything out, video, blog post, audio on, on our Instagram, please tag us and leave us a review and we will talk to you in two weeks.

Biz Bomb – Pushing Through Fear of Getting Yourself out There

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Drumroll please!!! The secret to pushing through the fear that comes with running a business? Is realizing that the fear doesn’t go away. Not much of a secret hey? No matter how long you’ve been in the business, you will always be fearful, feel vulnerable about something!

You may feel impostor syndrome, have self-worth issues, or just feel like your confidence has gone out the window. You are not alone in feeling this way. In fact, a lot of times when we sign up to be a health coaching, we don’t actually realize that means that we were going to have to put ourselves online out to a bunch of strangers.

We get it! It still feels uncomfortable putting ourselves out online. It always feels uncomfortable launching a new product to the Internet *cough* like Kendra's HTMA Expert Course *cough*. It always feels uncomfortable when you're vulnerable. Putting yourself out there online is like sitting on a podium and letting people throw judgment at you.

But with fear, can come great reward and success! And if you don’t fit through the fear, how will you ever know if you’ll achieve your goals and establish yourself as a successful business owner?

So the secret is: the fear doesn’t go away. And you absolutely MUST push past it. No matter how many courses you do, unless they are self-help courses, that fear will remain.

What action are you going to take this week to help your business move forward and help you push through the fear? Let us know in the comments on any of our social channels, or leave us a review on any podcast listening platform!

Some of our favorite ways of pushing through fear? Journalling, visiting the therapist, but above all else, acknowledging that yes – we am scared and yes, we WILL get through it.

Interested in HTMA - Hair Mineral Analysis Testing? Kendra has launched a brand new 6 week course that not only teaches you how to interpret HTMA but also how to confidently develop protocols for your clients! Sign up here and don't delay! The course closes on August 19 and starts August 20!

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Hey guys, Kendra here. Welcome to your Biz Bomb episode of the 360 Health Biz podcast. So this is where we give you a super quick tip for your biz and it's so juicy and it's so awesome that it's basically like dropping a bomb on your brain and then your head explodes.
So today we're going to talk about pushing through fear and I'm going to tell you the number one secret to pushing through the fear of putting yourself out there on the Internet. Are you guys ready for it? We're going to get right into it. Drum roll please. The secret to pushing through fear is realizing that the fear doesn't go away. It doesn't go away.
Regardless of where you are in your business, when you're trying something new or you're doing something a little bit different or doing something out of your comfort zone. And let me tell you guys, you cannot run a business inside your comfort zone. So the fear, it doesn't go away.
I still get scared every time I put something new out online. Every time I do anything that's a little bit different than what I've currently been doing up until that point, I still get scared. I still have a bit of self-worth issues and I still feel the fear of putting myself out there. And I think this is a really, really important thing to realize. Even though you might feel a little bit annoyed with me right now because when you realize that the fear doesn't go away, what you understand is that you just have to push past it, right? And I think a lot of us, we have a lot of fear. We might have impostor syndrome, we might have self-worth issues, we might just not have a lot of confidence. And a lot of times when we signed up for our health coaching school, we didn't actually realize that meant that we were going to have to put ourselves online out to a bunch of strangers. It's a weird thing, right? It's not normal.
So the thing is there's no point in waiting until you get that next course or you're like, "If I do this, I'll feel more confident. Or if I get this knowledge, I'll feel more confident or I'll feel better about myself." Whatever it is, there's no point in waiting because regardless of how many courses you've taken, you're still going to feel that fear.
So when you know this, you realize that you just need to push through it. The only way to get over it is to not let it hold you back. And that is the thing, regardless of where you are, the fear is still there. The biggest difference though is that the fear stops holding you back. The fear stops being an excuse for not taking action. Okay?
So like I said, I still feel the fear and when I feel it, I acknowledge it and I realize that it's uncomfortable. I try to sit in it for a little while and be like, "Okay, this is pretty uncomfortable. I don't know about this," but I don't let it hold me back. So there's no point in continuing to update your education to take more and more health certification courses, thinking that that's going to give you more confidence. That is not going to make the fear go away. It doesn't go away. I've said it, I'm going to say it again. The fear does not go away. The uncomfort does not go away. It always feels uncomfortable putting yourself out online. It always feels uncomfortable launching a new product to the Internet. It always feels uncomfortable when you're vulnerable. Putting yourself out there, basically sitting on a podium and letting people throw judgment at you, that's uncomfortable, and that's never not going to feel uncomfortable.
So now that you know this, hopefully what you realize is it's uncomfortable. Running a business, it's uncomfortable. It doesn't feel good. It feels weird. It's scary. It makes you doubt yourself. But if you don't push past the fear, then you're never going to get yourself out there. Which means you're never going to have a successful business and you're never going to achieve those big, big, big goals that you have.
So this is really important, guys. I want you to tell me in the comments what action you are going to take this week that is going to help to move your business forward. Even if it's the tiniest, tiniest little action. Even if it's just sending an email to your email list, doing a Facebook Live. Maybe it's jumping on social media, jumping on Instagram Stories, doing an Instagram Live. Whatever it is, we want to know you if you're on IGTV right now because we do release these episodes on IGTV, so if you want to watch me on IGTV and see my face, you can leave me a comment and let me know what is the single action you're going to take this week that is going to help you push through the fear. Okay?
Let me know. If you're listening on the podcast, shoot us an email. Hello at Let us know what is the one single piece of action you're going to take. Push through the fear because nothing you do is going to make it go away no matter what. When you're new to this, you're going to feel uncomfortable. You're going to be scared, and it's not going to feel so good, but you have to do anyways. So let us know.
All right guys, I hope you enjoyed this episode. Make sure to take a screenshot of this episode. Share it on Instagram, mention 360 Health Biz podcast. Let us know what your biggest take-home was and we will share our stories. That helps us know that you like this content and you want us to keep delivering it to you. And remember, we release an episode every single Wednesday, so we will see you in a week from now.

Why Your Personal Brand is Your #1 Marketing Tool

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Personal branding is THE most important thing in 2019 when it comes to marketing yourself and your business. While brand colours and fonts are important, no one connects with a logo, they want to connect with YOU as a human being and as a practitioner or health coach.

If you are worried that people won’t like you…won’t like that post you put up, then you need to work on yourself before you work on your business. Here’s why. We ALL have triggers in our businesses. Our last episode with Lori Kennedy talked all about this and we talk about it again today…your business WILL bring out insecurities that you may or may not realize you have. As Kendra puts it, she sometimes feels like  she’s “still that girl in high school who's wondering if anyone's going to show up to my party”. So you need to make sure you have your support team to support you, so you can support others.

But let’s get back to personal brand. When you show up authentically, fearlessly, genuinely, and honestly….ladies and gentlemen, you have your brand. But don’t expect it to happen overnight. And if you’re just starting out, don’t expect it to stay the same. Often time our clients can actually shift our brand and our niche! It's not like you're just going to listen to this episode and know exactly what to do. It's going to be a work in process. You're going to make some mistakes. You're going to have to switch things and change things and revamp things. It's always a work in progress, but in the end just don't try to be who you think you should be, just be you. Just be who you are, exactly how you would in everyday life.

So how can you make your brand you? Kendra and Christine offer some great tips in today’s episode including how to make your Instagram more searchable, which platforms you should be on, ways to discover what your brand is (hint JOURNALLING!) and if you decide you can’t do it yourself and need a brand coach – what to look for in a brand coach.

 Oh, and don’t give a fuck what anyone else is doing. We like to say fuck…it’s part of our brand.

Jamie Palmer episode
Tapping Into Wealth, by Margaret Lynch
Heather Jones, EFT practitioner
Amber Dugger, financial coach​
Meryl Kreigsman
Doctor Drema Dial, psychologist

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Kendra Perry: Yo yo. What's up? 360 Health Biz [inaudible 00:00:04]. I'm trying to channel Brandon [Boomer 00:00:07], because he's always like "What's up holistic [inaudible 00:00:09] [savage tribe 00:00:09]?" What's up every one! Welcome to another episode of the 360 Health Biz Podcast. I am your first host, Kendra Perry, and I am joined by Christine Hansen who, we actually haven't hung out in a while, Christine.

Christine: I know its been like, I texted you, so it's like, "I miss you. It's been too long."

Kendra Perry: Yeah, we haven't recorded an episode in a while so we're super excited to hang out with you guys today. And we're talking about a topic that is so important. It's so, so important. And a lot of health coaches don't get it, right?

Christine: To be blunt, it's like duh, but no ... it's very true. And I think that Kendra and I both didn't get it for a long time.

Kendra Perry: Oh yeah. I only really got it like a year ago, I swear.

Christine: I agree.

Kendra Perry: It's something that's kind of like ... it's not super tangible, you have to kind of really think about it and kind of know what you're doing. But we're going to be talking about branding and personal branding. And the reason why we want to talk about this is because maybe in 2017 this was less important. Maybe in 2018 it was important but not the primary thing, but in 2019, it is like the [inaudible 00:01:16], you have to be successful. You need to have a personal brand. And in order to do that you actually have to know what that is.

Christine: Totally. So we're going to talk about that. We're going to give examples about how you get there, what to watch out for. Also maybe if you hire someone, you know what you should look out for. But first, we want to shout out a very special thank you to [Kimmy Classon 00:01:38], because she wrote us a five star review on iTunes. We love you.

Kendra Perry: We love you.

Christine: So here's what she's saying. "I'm not even a health coach and I love this podcast." Like this seriously, just the [inaudible 00:01:51] is just like makes my heart sick. "I use all the actionable steps in my business and they worked magic and momentum in my mission. I feel empowered that I too can build my biz of my dreams when I listen to these ladies and their amazing guests. So helpful. Thank you."

Kendra Perry: Thank you Kimmy. And I actually know Kimmy, and she's a sustainability coach. So she's done some really cool work with sustainability and climate change so follow her on Instagram.

Christine: I tip my invisible hat to you Kimmy. Like seriously. Amazing business. We're super happy that we can help. And actually, I'm going to drop a little teaser here because Kendra and I, we're working on something where we might be able to help you even a lot more in the future. So stay tuned. Just throwing that out there.

Kendra Perry: Just dropping the seeds, dropping the seed, shameless plug, shameless plug.

Christine: Totally. There you go, that's psychology, baby. Listen to that.

Kendra Perry: Totally.

Christine: Yes, branding. So I think we have to talk a little bit about what branding used to be. So we are the same age pretty much. And I think branding for a long time used to be the logo of MTV or Nike or McDonald's.

Kendra Perry: Like the colors, the font, you know. Visual, the visual.

Christine: Exactly. And the same colors or the same font all the time. And it was pretty much the graphic, I would say.

Kendra Perry: The graphic was really, really important. The logo was really important. And I mean I stressed so much about my logo when I first [inaudible 00:03:32], and now I actually haven't updated my logo like the whole time I've had my business. I need to update it but it doesn't really matter that much, so I just don't care.

Christine: Exactly. Exactly. So we will focus, obviously if you have a product it's still a little bit different. But we will talk about us as people, as service providers, where your brand is something completely different. And please keep all of this in mind when you're also looking to hire something with your branding, because there are people who are trained in this, but there's also people who are used to work with companies, or are just a little bit outdated frankly, who will get it wrong.

Christine: Yes. Just a couple pointers on what to look out for. So as Kendra said, we were at this social media marketing conference, and even before we noticed how branding is completely different. It doesn't have to do with your font, in a way. It does, but the most important piece of the puzzle is actually yourself. And that makes a lot of people squeal inside. It's like, "Oh no I don't want to. But I'm not special. I'm not cool. I'm not busy." Or whatever bullshit is in your head. And I think we're going to give you tangible action steps this episode. But I think the word that needs to go with branding, if you have your business and are selling yourself, and I want you to say that out loud actually, "I am selling myself." Without having the image of Pretty Woman and being a prostitute in your head.

Christine: Because a lot of time when we say this, "I'm selling myself." It's a connotation we just have, and it's bullshit. So I think the word that goes hand in hand with branding is personal development in a way, because you need to be you and you need to be authentic you. So I think the easiest is if Kendra and I are talking a little bit about our steps, so Kendra why don't you start a little bit with you're really, really happy with your brand right now, and it's totally is, so how did you get there?

Kendra Perry: Yeah, well I think ... well first of all was realizing that what people want these days, and we talked about this a little bit over the past few episodes that we recorded, people, they want to connect with you. We're in an era where social media is like a main way that we connect with people and it can feel really impersonal. So I think what people really are looking for is real human connection. They want to feel like they know you and that maybe they can be friends with you. And they want to feel like I could hang out with this chick. Like I really like her. She could be in my friend group and that would be awesome. And we would just hang and it would be cool.

Kendra Perry: And so I think for me the first thing was realizing that it's less about a brand so much as it is about a personal brand. You mentioned that with personal development, if you were a coach, and if you're listening to this podcast, you're probably a coach of some kind, whether it's a health coach or a fitness pro, whatever is is you're doing. You are your brand. So for me it was realizing that my brand is me, and I needed to stop faking what I thought people wanted to see me as, and be quote, unquote, "professional", and just be myself. And so that meant sharing more about me. So if you guys follow me you probably know that I'm really into the mountains and the outdoors, and I love adrenaline sports, right? So-

Christine: And crashing your bike, it's like [crosstalk 00:06:56]

Kendra Perry: Totally. Crashing my bike and wrecking my body. That's my thing, right? And so it was about figuring out how to infuse the things that are really important to me, my core values, which is being in nature, being in the mountains and pushing myself with sports, into my brand message and into what I'm actually doing with people. So it was taking a step back from just recording videos, with make up on, and looking all professional, and recording videos in my bike jersey. Or as I'm going for a walk or on the mountain bike trail, or whatever it is, and actually bringing that into what I do. So I think for me, it was just realizing that your brand is who you are.

Christine: I agree.

Kendra Perry: As a core human being. And what you stand for and your values. And it's not easy. It's not like you're just like, "This is me. This is what I stand for and I'm going to start combining my brand and who I am." It's a process, it takes time, and it takes a lot of deep personal work. Which I think comes back around to the personal development thing you were talking about Christine, right?

Christine: Yeah, and I think if both of us look at our history. I'm on website number four most likely. I love my website now but it's because I've changed it because I've grown. And it's fine. It took me three years to figure out who I am and what I want to do. I can confidently now say that I'm totally me and I love it, but it's not always been that great. So if you are a newbie coach, here's a little advice with love. Don't spend all your budget on a branding person yet. I would actually advertise you to keep it a little bit more generic in terms of clean and simple, rather than going all in, thinking you know who you are and thinking you know what your clients want and what resonates with them. Because I guarantee you, you will change again. And I'd rather use that budget on a coach or an energy worker, or whatever you are into, to help you figure out what makes you comfortable saying that sentence, "I am selling myself." Because if that doesn't feel comfortable to you, you have work to do. Until you get there, I'd budget more into that journey than necessarily the branding.

Kendra Perry: Yeah I completely agree, because the thing is you probably are going to change your niche. The niche that you start with, I would say more than likely you're going to change it at some point, right?

Christine: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Kendra Perry: You've changed your niche once or twice. I've changed it like four times. And I think it's just because you're going to think, "Oh I really want to talk about this topic." You're going to get out there, and maybe you're going to get sick of talking about it, or maybe your interests are going to take you elsewhere. Or maybe the people who are following you are going to take you elsewhere, and that's okay. So I do think go light, pick a few colors and fonts, that's cool, whatever. And then just actually sit down and journal. Actually sit down and think about who you really are.

Kendra Perry: When you sit down ... and I'd like to give the person who I heard this from credit, but I can't remember where I heard this, but it's really good. It's like your brand is what people say about you when you're not around.

Christine: Oh yeah.

Kendra Perry: Isn't that good?

Christine: That's good. It's very good.

Kendra Perry: Because how would you describe me? Oh she's like crazy and off the cuff, and outgoing, and outdoorsy. It's my personality, right? It's how people would describe me. So think about what people would say. And if you don't know maybe you should ask your friends and family.

Christine: Mm-hmm (affirmative). And I would also be ... whatever triggers you, whatever makes you feel uncomfortable, that's the point you need to investigate. You need to figure out why. Is it actually you or is it someone else's voice in your head. Until you understand who you are and what is actually your authentic issue, you will not be confident enough, and authentic enough. Because authenticity cannot be faked. Having said that, I have kind of a double split persona in a way. So I like different things. I like to be completely glam. I am now, also really like to be sexy, but I also really like to hang out with sneakers and a et-shirt. And I sometimes make it a point to go to these networking points where you have suit guys and ladies in their pant suits and stuff, and I just show up in trousers and sneakers because I'm like screw all of you, I can do whatever I want.

Christine: So I have this double persona, but the way that I did it was, okay, this type of persona is great for my website in terms of the first impression, also because I charge a certain price point. But when I'm on video or when I do my Instagram stories, I'm very, very basic and down to Earth. And if you go to my Instagram you'll also see that my photo shoots are like that. Some are a little bit more posh and some are just with sneakers and a et-shirt and jeans. So they're all part of me, but I'm having to say it's always polished most of the time, but if you do charge a certain price point, you also, you don't have to, but it can help to appear in a certain way. Again, it's authentic to you though. I love my Louboutins. I Have to say I never wear them if I have to wear them for more than 10 minutes walking, but I look pretty damn hot when I do wear them. So it's like this double thing. But you need to own every piece of you. And I think, depending on what your business is, you push some of it forward for your website, but you need to be comfortable with it.

Christine: If you never wear shoes like that because you're uncomfortable or because you don't like the people who wear those shoes or whatever is coming with it, don't do it. Really, really don't do it. People smell it out. And I think in the end you need to remember that people will get to know you. They will buy your service and they will get to know you. And if it doesn't coincide, they will be disappointed. And damn, that's also how we have our dream clients because they connect with the authentic us. It's a take it or leave it thing. If you don't like the way we are, you know what you get, basically. We don't sell anything that's not authentic. And I think that's how you get the raving testimonials afterwards because people actually know you. And you didn't promise anything that didn't happen. And you didn't sell yourself as someone who you're not. So I think that's super, super important to understand.

Kendra Perry: Yeah, I think it's a really good point. I was speaking with a coach the other day and she was getting frustrated with social media, and trying to show up as who she thought she should be, right? Which was what we were talking about in the beginning. And she's someone who has a big ranch, and she has horses. And I mean all her days are spent outside with the horses. And I was like, you need to do your videos in the field with your horses. And she's like, actually I did a video in her horse stall where she was picking up horse poop and talking about how the poop ... it's annoying to pick up, but it means her horses are healthy and stuff like that. And kind of weaving it into health and whatever. And she was like, "I felt really fired up in that video." I'm like, "Yeah. Because you're in your element." Right?

Christine: Exactly.

Kendra Perry: Just like Christine said, if you're not a fancy person, then don't do a photo shoot wearing all this makeup and a fancy dress.

Christine: No. Oh it looks horrible.

Kendra Perry: My photo shoots are action sports stuff. Me in casual wear. Sometimes I just have selfies with no make up on because half the time I'm in the forest biking and my make up is off my face. It's streaming down the side of my face because I just did a podcast and now I'm going biking and I'm sweating like a pig, right?

Kendra Perry: So I think it's about figuring out who you are, but showing that on your social media and on your website. People should really feel like, like Christine says, that it lines up. When they meet you in person you should be the same person. And people are going to feel like they know you and when they actually meet you they want to be like, "Oh wow. She's just like she is online."

Christine: Exactly. And it's so funny because I see people on Zoom, when I have my first sessions with them. And they're like, "Oh you actually look like you do in your photos. You look the same way." And I'm like, yes. Because they like, "Well, I've people when I saw them on their website and then I saw them on video and it's completely crazy."

Kendra Perry: Yeah, totally.

Christine: Hang on, just one second. It's raining and one of my windows closed automatically and the other one hasn't. So now I'm wondering if they all close automatically. Okay, it's fine, sorry.

Kendra Perry: Random, side note there.

Christine: Sorry, sorry. I just wouldn't want it to [inaudible 00:15:34] anything, but fine. Yes. So, no, I think that's really important. And that's also why I really want to say, if you want to work with a branding coach, which I think, at some point, you should do. Someone who writes the copy and someone who understands fonts, who just knows all of them, and who can tell you immediately this corresponds your persona. Here's a really important thing to keep in mind. First of all they need to understand what you do. Because yesterday I talked to someone, and she's doing, she's a licensed psychiatrist, but she's also working with meditation and energy work. When she was working with a branding coach, they had no idea what she was actually doing. And she was like, "Okay how is she supposed to ..." Sorry cat ...

Kendra Perry: Aww cute.

Christine: "How is she supposed to write or to represent me if she doesn't even know what I do?" So I think that's a big, red flag right there.

Christine: The other thing is that if, as soon as the coach or consultant, tries to fit you into a box, run for the hills. It's just not what they should do. They should listen and then they should work and design something upon it. They should not say, okay, I think you should be this and this and this, because this and this and this sells. Bullshit. I call bullshit.

Kendra Perry: I worked with a coach who kind of did something like that. And really pushed me into talking about weight loss. And I'm sorry but I hate weight loss. It's not ... I mean I don't feel like I'm someone who's like ... I'm fit but I don't have this ripped body, and I just hate the before and after photos of [crosstalk 00:17:17]

Christine: Yeah.

Kendra Perry: I feel like you attract, not always, but depending on how you position yourself, but you often attract people who want to just lose weight, and they don't care about their health. And that's something I'm interested in. But she really kind of pushed me into that space, and then when I launched what I had to launch, it totally flopped. And I think it was because I was super out of alignment with what I actually was doing. And I was like, I don't even want to do this. What am I doing? So you do have to be wary of that. And I think when you think about ... you obviously need to know ... we talk so much about knowing who your ideal client is and figuring out who you're talking to. That's a big part of brand building. You need to be specific, you need to know who you're trying to attract.

Kendra Perry: But you also want to know how do you want people to feel when they come into contact with your business. Like with Christine, if I'm an entrepreneur, a CEO, I might get that luxury, high end feel, and maybe that's what you want people to feel. And when people come to my business, they might feel inspired to go climb a mountain or they feel like, get this nature-y feel. You want them to have a feeling about your business, and that's ...

Christine: Great.

Kendra Perry: That's great.

Christine: No, I totally agree. I agree. And it's also, yes, for me I think if you're authentic, you will automatically attract the right clients. Like some will just Google, they find your website, and they schedule a call with you and they have no clue what you actually do. But I find the hardcore fans, usually they take some time, they stalk you for a while, and then they get in touch. And you have this perfect client-coach, expert, whatever dynamic. And they are ready then to spend money with you because they trust you, because you never lie, and because you're just authentic. And if you screw up, you screw up, and it's fine. And they know that it's human and that's it.

Christine: And I personally, I also, it's really funny because I worked with someone, and I admire her still, she's amazing. But in the beginning, three years ago, her branding was very subtle, and she was no make up or just tiny bits, and it was just, I loved it. Because at the time, I don't know if you remember, everyone had this gold written font and it was just about boss babe and personal glam, six figure, seven figures. There was gold everywhere and everyone was wearing these business dresses and big hair on the beach, that kind of thing. And she was just ... she had a black dress, she was very sober, and it was all about what she was saying. Super intelligent thing. I loved it because she was different because that's the way she was.

Christine: Now she has one of these photographers that I know shooting a lot of people who are pretty in in the industry right now, and they all look the same. And it's all over the top glitz and glam. And it's like everyone is one a unicorn boat, float thing. And I'm just like, I cannot have it with the graffiti in the background. Everyone looks the same now and it's not high end. It's just like an overblown ego. It's not the same. Development, becoming more confident, does not mean that your ego is taking over. I think that's also important to keep in mind.

Kendra Perry: Yeah. Yeah. I think that's really important to keep in mind. You really want to be true to yourself. It's not the easiest thing to do but it's easier in the long run because in the long run you're just yourself. You're not trying to develop this persona of someone who you aren't. I'm sure we've all met people in our life who we felt were fake. And we felt like they were hiding something or they weren't being their true selves, and something was off. And we didn't want to hang out with those people. So you don't want to be that person to your audience, right?

Kendra Perry: And I have a little list here because I think journaling can be really helpful. I think you can sit down and really consider this, but I have some questions you can ask yourself when you're journaling. And the first one is what are you unique qualities and strengths? We all have them, we all have unique parts about our personalities. We all have unique strengths. And if that's a hard question for you to answer, like I said, talk to your friends and family. Sit down with your bestie. They might help you see a side of you that maybe is less obvious to yourself.

Kendra Perry: What are five words that your friends would use to describe you? Again, you can talk to your friends, right? What are your core values? What do you stand for in your business? How do people benefit from working with you? And how do you want people to feel after they come into contact with your business?

Kendra Perry: Really, really think about this. Do some journaling. And you might have some big aha moments. Because the truth is we all are unique, individual people. And these days people don't want the cookie cutter approach. They don't want some monotone practitioner in front of a camera being super professional, with no emotion and no personality. People are not going to watch that video.

Kendra Perry: If you're someone who likes to crack inappropriate jokes, crack inappropriate jokes. If you like to say fuck, say fuck. I say it all the time and it's honestly, it can be very polarizing. I mean people hate me for it. I get people ... it's the most common thing that people write to me and tell me to watch my mouth and I have a dirty mouth. But I don't care. If they hung out with me in person they would probably be like, "This girl swears to much and I don't want to hang out with her." Whatever, right? It's okay. There's someone else out there for them. It's not me and it doesn't need to be.

Christine: Perfect. I totally agree.

Kendra Perry: We like to say fuck.

Christine: A lot. And it's a great thing. I don't know why people are so offended. It's super great. Awesome.

Christine: But there was something else I wanted to say and it slipped my mind so let's continue because I-

Kendra Perry: Okay. Well I wanted to talk a little bit about Instagram because we really love Instagram right now. And honestly, in terms of a social media platform I do think it's probably one of the best ones to build a personal brand. It's very visual. There's a lot of ways you can share content. You can post in your feed, you can do Instagram stories, you can do IGTV, you can do Instagram live. Literally, there's four different ways to interact on Instagram, and they're all different ways to show your personalities. But I have some crazy pet peeves when it comes to Instagram. And I wanted to just talk about this quickly.

Kendra Perry: So you can do an experiment. Click on the people who you're following or people who are following you. And scroll down and look at the accounts that you're most likely to want to click into and learn more about. I almost guarantee it's not someone who's using a logo as their image, their profile picture. When I see a logo, I don't want to click into that at all. There's nothing. There's no human connection. I have no connection to a graphic or a logo. But when I see a cool picture of someone, I'm like, "Ooo, what does that chick do? Oh what does that dude do?" So I think-

Christine: Exactly. I mean the exception to the rule is obviously if you have a product or if you are like Mont Blanc of something like that, sure, use your logo. But let's talk about us people. Don't use your logo. Who cares?

Kendra Perry: Nobody cares about your logo and there's no connection there. Even if our Instagram handle or your business name is not your name, you are still your brand. So you have to have a photo there.

Kendra Perry: And then next of all your name, if your handle is like "climbtothetopwellness", I don't know, that's a weird business.

Christine: Or "sleeplikeabus".

Kendra Perry: Yeah, or "sleeplikeabus". You are still your brand so your name has to be somewhere in your bio. Because just think of it this way, imagine you have a logo and your names not in your bio. And then you DM somebody, like an ideal client to try to connect. They're going to be like ...

Christine: Who's that?

Kendra Perry: They're not going to follow you. You're not even a human.

Kendra Perry: And then the other thing is maybe I scroll down your feed and you don't even show up anywhere on your feed. There's no photos of you.

Christine: I hate that. I cannot stand it. These meme things, where people only put their memes of things. No. I would never hire you. I don't know who you are. I don't see you. I only see memes. I only see quotes, but who are you? It just tells me that your self-confidence is down the toilet, why would I want to learn from you? Sorry.

Kendra Perry: Yeah. Like you, honestly, I think like every second photo ...

Christine: It is. It's my strategy.

Kendra Perry: [crosstalk 00:25:42] I see you. And I mean it actually makes your Instagram look really visual, when you just do like photo of you, and then maybe you can do your quote or your meme, something with like white space.

Christine: Exactly. Or whatever.

Kendra Perry: You could literally show up everyday on your feed. And I know it feels very narcissistic, but it's actually what people want from you. Those photos are going to do better, so from an Instagram perspective, you need to make it clear who you are. People need to go to your thing and see your photo and see your name. And then obviously see what they do, but I feel like I'm like a broken record. I've talked about this so much and I just see it so much. Like people who [crosstalk 00:26:18] health coaching, advice and marketing. And I'm just like, oh my god, I go on your profile [crosstalk 00:26:26] there, your photo's not there. You just have a list of all the schools you went to and your certifications.

Christine: Nobody cares.

Kendra Perry: Nobody cares.

Christine: Agreed. And you're much more searchable. So when people ask me how do I find you on Instagram, I tell them you can either look for "Christine Hansen" because my name is "Christine Hansen Sleep Expert", or you can look for "sleeplikeabus" because that's my handle. So you will find me whatever you type, which is amazing. So people do it. Use your name. I would suggest use your name and your business title. And just decide is your name going to be your business name or is your handle going to be whatever. But that way you're searchable twice, which is super cool.

Christine: The other thing is if you do want your credentials, just line a couple and then say dot, dot, dot. Like for example in my bio, I say that I've been featured in National Geographic books, et cetera. So even I have this little space available, I just do dot, dot, dot, but it's really, really helpful. Then a greet, use your personal picture and a quote or a blog or something like that.

Christine: And here's another tip, what I do ... because I use a personal picture every second day during the week. And Kendra and I did this for our pictures, whenever we go traveling, we go to Airbnb Experiences and book a photo shoot. And they're usually around 80 bucks, and you get 20 to 25 pictures is the norm, I think. And you get great pictures, like really great photographers out there. And they're perfect for Instagram and drop posts and so forth. So it's not expensive. It doesn't break the bank. And you can constantly feed fresh photos into your feed. It's Instagram, people are there because it's a visual platform, get over yourself.

Kendra Perry: Take good photos, right? Yeah, we started doing that ... I don't know, not that long ago. But our branch shoot that we did for the podcast, we just did it in San Diego on the beach with this photographer who seemed really introverted and not confident. And I was like, "Oh I don't know how this is going to go." But they were great photos. Really, really. And tons of them, right?

Christine: Exactly.

Kendra Perry: And it cost us like a hundred bucks or something.

Christine: Not even. Not even. And it doesn't even need to be ... like I like to have a photographer do photos because I don't know who else I would ask all the time, but if you go to see celebrities, like Reese Witherspoon, she does have some of her old photos, that were new ones, but she had a lot of photos that friends took with their iPhones, of her. Obviously she knows how to pose but it just goes to show you don't always need the professional angle. If you have someone, I don't know, a boyfriend or just a friend you hang out with, or a partner or whatever, or just a good friend, and where ever you are, you ask them can you take a picture of me, don't feel uncomfortable about it. Just say it's for my job. You can even do it with your iPhone or whatever smart phone you have. The camera's are so good nowadays.

Kendra Perry: They're so good.

Christine: The portrait mode, hello.

Kendra Perry: Hello portrait mode.

Christine: How much you can do, it's crazy.

Kendra Perry: It's such a good point because if you go on my feed, there's some photos on there that are processional, but there's a lot of photos that are literally just taken with my Google phone or my boyfriend's Google phone, and it's a really good, high quality camera. Now I also have a little tripod for my phone, so when I go places, I might just put on the timer and get a quick photo of me doing something. Actually, I posted an Instagram post on the editing eps that I use, but maybe that would be a good episode for an upcoming Biz Bomb episode, because I have like two apps that I pull things into that will take a photo that's pretty average, and I have my pre-set, and then I clean up my complexion and I clean up the colors, and suddenly it's a professional photo. It doesn't need to be a big deal. And in the end even selfies are better than not being on your feed.

Christine: Absolutely. And I would advocate that you have some kind of structure on your feed, and anything that you want to throw out there is your stories. That's how I handle it. So if I take a crazy selfie or just some snap shots from when I'm out and about, I still evaluate what I put into my stories, it's always personal. Usually it's my personal life and just showing ... because again it's part of my brand. When I travel first class it's part of my brand. It's who I am, it's what I sell. But also when I'm in the bathtub with my new kittens, that's also kind of who I am.

Christine: And you use it even more for marketing. I haven't done it quite as much yet. So there's so much wiggle room, as long as you stay true to yourself. So use gifs that you would usually use, use emojis that you would usually use. The fonts, there are so many different ones that you can use. They all have pros and cons I find, but use colors that you would use, that you find pretty. Just use things that you find attractive and I find that you are already on brand.

Kendra Perry: Yeah, and it's a good point with Instagram Stories because when it comes to personal branding, and I think we're both on board with this Christine, is that we really think you need to use video to build a brand, right?

Christine: My god yes.

Kendra Perry: It's really hard to push out your personality on a blog post, on social media posts.

Christine: Unless you're a super good writer.

Kendra Perry: Unless you're the most amazing writer in the world.

Christine: But even then people get sick of that.

Kendra Perry: They want to see you, right?

Christine: Exactly. And they combine it. I'm a huge [Laura Bell Grey 00:31:56] fan. I worked with her a couple of times. And her [inaudible 00:32:00] are amazing. They're full of her personality, and she just does it because she's amazingly talented. But even so, she still uses photos too. But she manages to ... she's so talented it's crazy. Not a lot of people are. Just don't consider yourself to be as talented I would say.

Kendra Perry: Yeah, and there's so many ways to share video content these days. And I think people get really uncomfortable and nervous about live video, but if you're not comfortable on life video, you can still share pre-recorded video. Instagram Stories is all pre-recorded video. IGTV, which is the biggest bang for your buck for engagement on Instagram right now, like seriously, it is the biggest bang for your buck. I'm getting like six times more engagement on my IGTV videos than I am on feed posts right now, and even Instagram Stories. Instagram really wants to push it. And it's a pre-recorded video, maximum 10 minutes. What a great amount of time to get super to the point but actually teach and educate people.

Christine: Exactly. And I expect that your Instagram feed is going to be like your mini-website and your IGTV is what Instagram is pushing for, like I really think that's video and so forth.

Christine: And a little trick that I have because I never expect to actually watch or listen to whenever I do a video or a podcast, so whenever they do I'm super surprised and that's not a lie. Because I just assume, and Kendra and I are just recording this, but I actually don't ... well I do believe it, I know it's true, but I never have, in the back of my head, that you guys will actually watch all of [inaudible 00:33:41]. So whenever I speak with you I'm just like, "Oh god this is so embarrassing, you actually listen?" It's really weird, so I kind of bubble myself into that world and that's how it works for me. But I think that's something you could do. Just assume nobody's ever going to watch it.

Kendra Perry: I mean in the end, especially when you're new, probably not a lot of people are going to be watching it anyways. And I think it's really important, with video, like it's not something that we both came into the world being good at. If you go back, I'm sure, and look at Christine's early videos or my early Facebook lives, it's like not the same person because I was not comfortable. The first time I went live on video was Periscope when that used to be a thing.

Christine: Oh my god, it was so embarrassing.

Kendra Perry: I know, I hated it because I go live on this video. I'm like, been nervous all day. I've created this whole script. I'm so, so, so nervous. And then all I'm getting is comments being like, "Nice pitch, show your boobs."

Christine: Show your boobs. Yes.

Kendra Perry: And I'm like what is happening, what is happening? I'm trying to talk about adrenal fatigue, what's happening? I don't know why all the perverts were on Periscope, but that's where they hung out.

Christine: Yeah, agreed.

Kendra Perry: Luckily you don't have to deal with that on Facebook live. But I think it's something that you will never be good at unless you do it consistently. You've got to do it all the time. And eventually ... like I never would have thought that I could just hop onto live video with no preparation and just talk about a subject at length. I never would have thought I would do that, but now I can, because I've probably put out 300 live videos at this point in my career, right?

Christine: Yes. Yes. And also again, if I look at my first videos, I feel comfortable with it, it's because I always taught and always done things like that, but I wasn't myself in the beginning. I still have straightened hair and all kinds of bullshit. But now you just see me with bed hair.

Kendra Perry: I feel like you're in your bed when you record at the time.

Christine: I am actually. I actually am. And you'll see my headboard or I'm in my hotel room and I just rolled out of bed. And it's not even having make up on. And it doesn't matter. And funny enough, I sometimes feel that the videos I shoot off location, so without studio lights and here in my office, but I do spontaneously at an airport or in my hotel room, so very often those will get the most resonance. So mix it up. Keep it professional but also don't be afraid to just impromptu shoot a video. Because you can, you have your phone with you. There's nothing else you need.

Kendra Perry: Yeah, absolutely. And something also that's kind of cool too, is I think YouTube just introduced vertical video. So if you're making an IGTV video, with is just going to be vertical, like you holding your phone, you can actually just upload it to YouTube as well, straight from a YouTube app on your phone. So that's something they just rolled out. So repurposed content, right, is a really good way to ...

Christine: Totally.

Kendra Perry: Hope I won't go crazy.

Christine: Exactly. So watch out or listen to our episode with Jamie Palmer, I think it's the second or third episode on our podcast ever. It's still one of my favorites. And [inaudible 00:36:47] and I work with Jamie actually.

Kendra Perry: Yeah, we do. We love Jamie.

Christine: We love her. But its changed both of our businesses tremendously. So go and have a look at that. When you know who you are, when your branding is ready, then go and have a look at that.

Kendra Perry: Yeah, and especially when you're new. I know it's easy to compare yourself to other people, like if you go check out, like my business you'll see that I'm on all the social media platforms, but I also have a team. I have a team of people who does that. When you're new and starting out, you can't make specific content for every platform. You need to choose one platform that you know that's where your ideal client is hanging out, and maybe it's a platform that you actually enjoy using, and then just try to make one piece of content each week, and then you repurpose, right? And you put it out on other platforms. But this is a little bit off topic, but it's also [crosstalk 00:37:32].

Christine: The only other thing also that I want to say, and you just said it, that don't try to be like other people, is that sometimes people say look at what other people do in your industry. And I would actually highly encourage you against that. Because you are different. And for example, I don't have a problem training people at what I do and become a member of my team, because I know that even if five of us do exactly the same thing, and they are going to, whoever the potential client is, is going to resonate with someone different. And I see it because one of mentees just used my tagline. And I told her she could use part of it, not all of it. But it doesn't actually suit here. Because when you talk to her, she isn't like that. So whenever I work with my mentees, although we use the same structure and we have the same business, they all have a different person they are drawn to and that they naturally connect with.

Christine: And I ask them that, you know? "Who are the people who usually open up to you? Who are the people that just when you are in a room with people, who you just suddenly sit somewhere, offside, having a beer with and just a great conversation. Who are they?" Those are the people who are you, who you naturally resonate with. So don't use copy from someone else's website. Even if you just change it a little bit. It's not you. Whenever you're you, it's your brand, it's your voice, it's your aesthetic. The same as I find some very sleek fonts very nice, whereas others are more for the brushstroke kind of thing. You need to go with what belongs to you, what you would wear if you could put it on. And if you had a fashion show to go to to represent you, what would you feel most comfortable in, that's you.

Kendra Perry: Yeah, I agree.

Christine: But don't copy it, it's not going to work.

Kendra Perry: Yeah, and I think people, you want to write your copy and write your social media posts exactly like you would talk. How would you actually talk? If you were just going to write that social media post, no one's going to see it as a journal entry, like what would it actually look like. And I think the biggest compliment you can get is when someone's like, "I already feel like I know you." I get that with my strategy sessions with the coaches, and they're like, "I feel like I already know you." They don't realize it but that's the best compliment that anyone can give me because that means that what I'm doing is working, right?

Christine: Exactly. Exactly. And don't hide yourself. Don't pretend to be anything that you're not. And I noticed it a lot recently, the latest podcast interviews that I've done, and I've done quite a few in the last two to three months. People love them. And it's not me just saying that. I literally had three people get back to me yesterday about three different podcast interviews, and saying, "This was such a great episode." And it's episodes where I talk about how I changed, how, yes, my marriage ended. But also how I made money, the crosses I had to go through, the ugly sides, but also everything I believe in, which might be sometimes uncomfortable. And just being, not vulnerability alert, blah, blah, blah, but just like I'm not better than you just because sometimes things were hard, this is just what it's like. I'm being very honest.

Christine: And I think that's the other thing, when you're journaling or whenever something triggers you, always ask yourself am I honest right here? Honesty is the most important word that you can have in your life. I honestly ... I honestly believe that. I really think so.

Kendra Perry: Yeah. I mean I love that. Honesty. It's so true. Like we said, it doesn't happen overnight. It's not like you're just going to listen to this episode and know exactly what to do. It's going to be a work in process. You're going to make some mistakes. You're going to have to switch things and change things and revamp things. It's always a work in progress, but in the end just don't try to be who you think you should be, just be you. Just be who you are, exactly how you would in everyday life.

Christine: Agreed. And I just want to do a little bonus thing here. I just really quickly want to share the people and the tools that helped me the most. And you can do too, Kendra.

Kendra Perry: Sure.

Christine: But one thing that I'm sharing all the time, listen to my podcast interviews, is Tapping Into Wealth, by Margaret Lynch. If you want to be comfortable with money and selling yourself, then I've worked with a couple of different coaches. But one that I'm still working with regularly is [Halinda 00:42:04] Moors, so Moors M-O-O-R-S. She's my energy, quantum field kind of person. I still don't know how it works exactly, but it works. I also work with Heather Jones, she's an EFT practitioner that really helped. I worked with Amber Dugger, my financial coach.

Kendra Perry: We had her on the podcast. She's on like a [inaudible 00:42:22] episode.

Christine: She's amazing.

Kendra Perry: Check it out.

Christine: Check it out. [Katimonstas 00:42:26] Peters is also ... she's a witch, really. She's amazing. Check it out. She's fantastic, helped me a lot. So I work with [Meryl Creeksman 00:42:36]. She's changed her business so she doesn't offer the same package that I used to do. And then those were I think, personal development wise, huge. And also Doctor Drema Dial. She's a psychologist and she's helped me a lot too. And [Robin Collette 00:42:53]. So you can see I work and get help from a lot of different people. But you meet people when you're supposed to meet them. And they've helped me tremendously over the last time. And you cannot do it alone. I think that's the message. And I would have saved so much money if I had worked, well more, on my own personal development earlier.

Kendra Perry: I agree.

Christine: And it never stops.

Kendra Perry: It never stops. Yeah like I always talk about having three counselors. For talk therapy, I see someone for trauma release, and then me and my partner see a couples counselor even though our relationship is great, because we work on prevention, right? And just continually learn how to better communicate with each other. But the counseling has been a big thing for me because you do get triggered in your business. It will bring out all your biggest insecurities. Every time I launch something, I'm still that girl in high school who's wondering if anyone's going to show up to my party, right?

Christine: I know because you tell me and it's adorable. And I'm like, "Kendra, chill." Is anyone going to show up to my party?

Kendra Perry: I know. It's funny but I get triggered from high school because I was bullied, I had really toxic female friends in my life. I've actually seen some of that, those feelings in high school come up recently in my business, especially in relation to internet trolls. That's something I've been dealing within my business recently. So I called up my counselor and I was like, "I'm ready to deal with the high school shit. Let's go four sessions and let's go for it." I don't want some stranger on the internet who hates their life, who just wants to spew negativity at me, affect me the way that it affects me. It really affects me and it has nothing to do with me. So I can tell that it's triggering high school Kendra.

Christine: Exactly. And then you cry, it's hard, it sucks, you're sick for two days, and then you get through it.

Kendra Perry: That's right. And you learn to recognize it. Those feelings are still going to come up, you're still going to feel that triggering sensation, but when you do the personal work and you actually grow and start to heal, you're able to step back from it and be like, "Okay, that's triggering me. Why is that triggering me? Okay cool. These are the tools that I have so that I don't go into fight or flight."

Christine: Exactly. And that's when you show up authentically, fearlessly, genuinely, honestly, and that, ladies and gentlemen, is your brand.

Christine: All right. Juicy, juicy stuff girl. Now I have like goosebumps all over.

Kendra Perry: I know, I'm sweating, but it's actually [crosstalk 00:45:31]

Christine: I know. [crosstalk 00:45:35] I hope they can't see the little sweat things on my noose.

Kendra Perry: I'm glad everyone can't see my boob sweat.

Christine: My god. No I like, I have the weirdest sweat spot, it's under my lip and on my nose. Like I swear all the glands are on my nose.

Kendra Perry: I get the sweat mustache.

Kendra Perry: All right guys, thank you so much for putting up with us as always. We're always completely blown away when you want to hang out with us. It's like so weird. But what I am going to say? Oh yeah, if you like this episode and you are an Instagram user, screenshot this episode on Instagram, share it to your stories, and tell us your biggest take home. And we will share your stories, to our story, because we love Instagram, and we love Instagram Stories. And if you don't use Instagram, just go give us a five star review on iTunes. No big deal, no big deal. [inaudible 00:46:27]

Christine: It would make us very, very happy.

Kendra Perry: Yeah it will. And we'll read it on air.

Christine: Yes, yes. Absolutely. All right. Have a great time every one and we'll talk to you in two weeks.

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